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Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

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Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#11

Post by belorn »

boomboomsubban wrote: post #5
atonse wrote: post #2

After reading the NSA article about getting ISIS in very subtle ways that makes it seem like technical glitches, does anyone believe that there were actual “technical glitches” preventing this guy from testifying on video about his CIA torture?

Though he did suffer some technical difficulties, he did not testify as the court ruled his testimony was not relevant to the case. Subtly is not even necessary.

The paragraphs in the article.

"In the United Kingdom, Assange’s legal team has been allowed to enter this evidence into the public record. However, during a potential trial in the United States, it will likely be excluded as irrelevant because the Espionage Act does not allow a public interest defense."

"The Central Criminal Court in London was prepared for El Masri to testify. An interpreter was lined up for the ninth day of proceedings. However, technical problems prevented him from addressing the court beyond his written statement.

Prosecutors also objected to El Masri giving live testimony. According to Court News UK reporter Charlie Jones, that prompted Assange to stand up and proclaim, "I will not accept you censoring a torture victim's statement to this court.""

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#12

Post by fit2rule »

Its also preposterous that Americans will continue to justify these heinous acts as "might makes right", and then go on with their day, ignoring their states immense crimes against humanity in their effort to 'get theirs'... but yeah, drop the ol' "Ma' Russians!" into the conversations, and heads explode. There is literally no difference between the chemical castration of Assange inside a prison, and what "th' Russians" can do with a tea cup. One is covert and duplicitous, and the other is overt - but the message is the same: Journalists who uncover state crimes are the enemy of the state.

It seems we are in the quandary of the masses. Until Americans start feeling the repercussions of their states war crimes and crimes against humanity, they will simply allow them to continue to occur. Making further terrorism pretty much inevitable, on one side, and further leaks from real patriots, on the other side.

Anyway .. Assange is the tip of the ice berg.

For as long as Americans continue to ignore the burning piles of rubble that are the product of their state, the leaks will continue.

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#13

Post by sfjailbird »

acqq wrote: post #9
atonse wrote: post #2

After reading the NSA article about getting ISIS in very subtle ways that makes it seem like technical glitches, does anyone believe that there were actual “technical glitches” preventing this guy from testifying on video about his CIA torture?

The article about NSA "getting ISIS" mentioned: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24520757 Once there, see the posts by bashinator and _kbh_ for other sources. Back to the topic here, the "technical glitches" were present throughout the process, as reported day after day on: https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/ E.g. "This hearing has frequently been interrupted by the strange incompetence of the Ministry of Justice in…

Shouldn't they just postpone the proceedings until the "technical issues" are fixed?

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#14

Post by oarsinsync »

fit2rule wrote: post #12

Its also preposterous that Americans will continue to justify these heinous acts as "might makes right", and then go on with their day, ignoring their states immense crimes against humanity in their effort to 'get theirs'... but yeah, drop the ol' "Ma' Russians!" into the conversations, and heads explode. There is literally no difference between the chemical castration of Assange inside a prison, and what "th' Russia…

I’m going to ignore all the subjective incendiary rhetoric and focus on this (slightly edited) line:

> [Those] who uncover state crimes are the enemy of the state.

This is an interesting point, considering Snowdon made public improper behaviour, which resulted in him fleeing the country, while (at least some of) the improper behaviour has been declared illegal behaviour by a court of law. Meanwhile Snowdon remains persona non grata.

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#15

Post by malux85 »

oarsinsync wrote: post #14
fit2rule wrote: post #12

Its also preposterous that Americans will continue to justify these heinous acts as "might makes right", and then go on with their day, ignoring their states immense crimes against humanity in their effort to 'get theirs'... but yeah, drop the ol' "Ma' Russians!" into the conversations, and heads explode. There is literally no difference between the chemical castration of Assange inside a prison, and what "th' Russia…

I’m going to ignore all the subjective incendiary rhetoric and focus on this (slightly edited) line: > [Those] who uncover state crimes are the enemy of the state. This is an interesting point, considering Snowdon made public improper behaviour, which resulted in him fleeing the country, while (at least some of) the improper behaviour has been declared illegal behaviour by a court of law. Meanwhile Snowdon remains pe…

I wonder if we can manipulate trump into freeing Assange and Snowden under the narrative “These heros exposed Obama’s crimes, you can be the hero who frees them”

(I know they are not “Obama’s” crimes but that’s the only way to get trump engaged, or maybe just “democrats” crimes)

I think he would run with it if only it didn’t set president for whistleblowers to blow the whistle on whatever he has done...I dont think he thinks deeply enough to consider secondary effects but those around him may

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#16

Post by elmo2you »

> .. in the United States, it will likely be excluded as irrelevant because the Espionage Act does not allow a public interest defense.

Remind me again, what made the USA any better than North Korea or any other off-the-rails criminal regime?

If this statement about the Espionage Act is correct, then why is there even a discussion whether Assange will get a fair trial in the USA? It's plain as daylight that he never will, even for that specific fact only.

In fact, any country that signed and ratified the UN's UDHR, should be barred from extraditing anyone to the USA. Especially for cases like these.

If this involved an African, Asian or a Middle Eastern country, the USA and EU would no doubt threaten with bombing the country into submission, if they would continue to violate basic human right in order to cover up their criminal actions.

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#17

Post by acqq »

malux85 wrote: post #15
oarsinsync wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m going to ignore all the subjective incendiary rhetoric and focus on this (slightly edited) line: > [Those] who uncover state crimes are the enemy of the state. This is an interesting point, considering Snowdon made public improper behaviour, which resulted in him fleeing the country, while (at least some of) the improper behaviour has been declared illegal behaviour by a court of law. Meanwhile Snowdon remains pe…

I wonder if we can manipulate trump into freeing Assange and Snowden under the narrative “These heros exposed Obama’s crimes, you can be the hero who frees them” (I know they are not “Obama’s” crimes but that’s the only way to get trump engaged, or maybe just “democrats” crimes) I think he would run with it if only it didn’t set president for whistleblowers to blow the whistle on whatever he has done...I dont think h…

> I wonder if we can manipulate trump into freeing Assange and Snowden under the narrative “These heros exposed Obama’s crimes, you can be the hero who frees them”

Apparently, no, as Trump has much higher priority of "controlling" the press. See "Trump’s campaign against the press" from the testimony of Mark Feldstein, who's a Professor of Broadcast Journalism at the University of Maryland and a witness for defense in this process:

https://assangecourt.report/witness-statement-feldstein

"Seen in this light, the administration’s prosecution of Julian Assange is part and parcel of its campaign against the news media as a whole. Indeed, Assange’s criminal indictment under the US Espionage Act is arguably its most important action yet against the press, with potentially the most far-reaching consequences."

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#18

Post by redis_mlc »

sfjailbird wrote: post #13
acqq wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article about NSA "getting ISIS" mentioned: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24520757 Once there, see the posts by bashinator and _kbh_ for other sources. Back to the topic here, the "technical glitches" were present throughout the process, as reported day after day on: https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/ E.g. "This hearing has frequently been interrupted by the strange incompetence of the Ministry of Justice in…

Shouldn't they just postpone the proceedings until the "technical issues" are fixed?

Yes. For those unfamiliar with video and phone testimony during court proceedings, even when they technically work, the defense doesn't have the same ability to normal cross-examination or monitoring that correct procedures are followed. It's like the case is always going off the rails.

An example is if somebody quotes from a document on the phone during a trial, but the document hasn't been submitted or cannot be found. What do you do next? Ask for a continuation for that one document? How about the second one? What if the reading is incorrect?

So to even attempt a bad video link is an injustice.

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#19

Post by luckylion »

belorn wrote: post #11
boomboomsubban wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Though he did suffer some technical difficulties, he did not testify as the court ruled his testimony was not relevant to the case. Subtly is not even necessary.

The paragraphs in the article. "In the United Kingdom, Assange’s legal team has been allowed to enter this evidence into the public record. However, during a potential trial in the United States, it will likely be excluded as irrelevant because the Espionage Act does not allow a public interest defense." "The Central Criminal Court in London was prepared for El Masri to testify. An interpreter was lined up for the ni…

How do judges generally deal with that kind of situation? "Oh, the connection's not working? Ah well, moving on, we're ignoring this witness"?

Re: Survivor of CIA Torture and Rendition Supports Assange at Extradition Trial

#20

Post by elmo2you »

slim wrote: post #3
atonse wrote: post #2

After reading the NSA article about getting ISIS in very subtle ways that makes it seem like technical glitches, does anyone believe that there were actual “technical glitches” preventing this guy from testifying on video about his CIA torture?

yes, I believe there's a team funded using millions of US taxpayer money working on sabotaging Assanges defense in every possible way including illegal and immoral ways like hacking, bribing, black mailing, etc..

You can bet on it. Also, these people will be highly motivated and not just be "doing their job".

They'll be made well aware that their "way of life" and "reality as they know it" literally depends on the success of their work. Considering how these people are part of a criminal enterprise, it can be argued it's actually a true self-fulfilling prophesy.

As far as I'm concerned, people involved in such actions deserve to be hunted down and illiminated with extreme prejudice, by any covert agency of any country that does actually respect due process of the legal system.

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