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Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

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Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#1
I’m an L4 at Amazon and will make about $150k this year (inclusive of stock growth). My job is fine, but I constantly struggle and wrestle with the fact that my job is considered unimpressive by my peers, and that regaining a positive total compensation trajectory is difficult to impossible now (for example, my peers at Lyft and Facebook make in excess of $300k with 2 years tenure. If I get promoted within the same time period I’ll make less than $200k). In addition, seeing constant microaggressions from people that work at elite companies like Google (identifying as “Googler” on social media, bragging about the fact that they get a WFH bonus or get fancy gifts or Hawaii offsites etc) has driven me into dark places in the last few months especially. Even when I try to study and prep for interviews it weighs on me like a brick because it feels like they’re just made to be superior.

I’ve tried therapy, but it hasn’t been effective. What are good strategies to mitigate this feeling?

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#2
(1) Recognize that getting rid of this mindset is going to be an uphill battle, because humans are wired to compare ourselves to our peer group, as a means of determining our status within it. It is okay that this is a hard thing to deal with, even if it seems like a profoundly "first world problem". Don't feel ashamed that you are dealing with it and don't be demoralized when it remains quite hard.

(2) Delete your social media accounts; they really enable the self-minimizing comparisons with other people. Try this out, at least for a bit: stop going on Twitter, Reddit, HN, Facebook, Instagram, etc. and see if this issue is on your mind as often over the course of a month.

(3) Recognize that you are making an objectively huge amount of money, even for a software engineer. It helps to keep some global perspective: even if the people you socialize with don't view your income as impressive, 99.5% of people in the world do. Contrary to the vibe on this site, most software engineers aren't making 300K+ each year.

(4) Recognize that money is not everything, and if you are otherwise happy with your job perhaps the money thing shouldn't matter that much. As people get older (at least in my experience), they tend to see this and start to value other things in their lives more. Try to socialize with some people outside of tech, doing something you enjoy (beer-tasting, hiking, playing board games, whatever) - though this may be quite hard to do right now depending on where you live.

(5) If none of the above make you feel better, its okay to decide that money (or the associated status) is a priority for you and pursue it: hit the books and apply to the jobs that you feel would pay you the amount you want. BUT, this feeling almost certainly won't magically go away if you get the job: you will find new people to compare yourself unfavourably to. And unless you're Jeff Bezos, there is always a bigger fish. And even if you are Jeff Bezos, there are always going to be 100 people working their hardest to dethrone you.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#3
Posting that you make $150k at Amazon and expect to get to $200k soon is exactly the “microagression” and bragging you complain about. If your peers put you down find a better crowd. In the world of people in the software business you have already succeeded. In the bigger world of people working shitty jobs for minimum wage, or the hundreds of thousands who lost their tenuous jobs because they can’t work from home, you’re just humble bragging and complaining about problems the large majority of people wish they had.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#4
post #2

(1) Recognize that getting rid of this mindset is going to be an uphill battle, because humans are wired to compare ourselves to our peer group, as a means of determining our status within it. It is okay that this is a hard thing to deal with, even if it seems like a profoundly "first world problem". Don't feel ashamed that you are dealing with it and don't be demoralized when it remains quite hard. (2) Delete your s…

Median US income for a software developer or engineer is around $105k. Median income for employed people in the US is less than $34k. Around 18 million Americans are unemployed.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#5
post #4
post #2

(1) Recognize that getting rid of this mindset is going to be an uphill battle, because humans are wired to compare ourselves to our peer group, as a means of determining our status within it. It is okay that this is a hard thing to deal with, even if it seems like a profoundly "first world problem". Don't feel ashamed that you are dealing with it and don't be demoralized when it remains quite hard. (2) Delete your s…

Median US income for a software developer or engineer is around $105k. Median income for employed people in the US is less than $34k. Around 18 million Americans are unemployed.

I'm not sure what this is responding to in my comment.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#6
post #5
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Median US income for a software developer or engineer is around $105k. Median income for employed people in the US is less than $34k. Around 18 million Americans are unemployed.

I'm not sure what this is responding to in my comment.

Adding some hard numbers to your point that $150k is an objectively huge income outside of the small bubble of highly-paid and overpaid software professionals. A lot of my friends and family make a lot less than I do, and work under worse conditions. If I complained about making less than someone at Google they would do worse than “microagress” me. That perspective and grounding in the real world sure helps me not feel bad that some people make more than I do.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#7
post #6
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what this is responding to in my comment.

Adding some hard numbers to your point that $150k is an objectively huge income outside of the small bubble of highly-paid and overpaid software professionals. A lot of my friends and family make a lot less than I do, and work under worse conditions. If I complained about making less than someone at Google they would do worse than “microagress” me. That perspective and grounding in the real world sure helps me not fe…

Yeah, having the perspective of people outside your bubble definitely helps. Outside of software engineers, I have seen this quite a bit in people I know that became doctors: its the natural thing to compare yourself to your perceived peers, so the comparison becomes the people at your hospital who are making more. The sudden reminder that there is a world outside of your bubble is a bit like splashing cold-water on your face.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#8
post #2

(1) Recognize that getting rid of this mindset is going to be an uphill battle, because humans are wired to compare ourselves to our peer group, as a means of determining our status within it. It is okay that this is a hard thing to deal with, even if it seems like a profoundly "first world problem". Don't feel ashamed that you are dealing with it and don't be demoralized when it remains quite hard. (2) Delete your s…

+1 for getting off social media. I quit all of them except occasionally reading/replying on HN and have felt much better. Social media is a colossal time suck that makes people feel worse about themselves. I no longer feel bad when Kanye microaggresses me and brags about his success.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#9
If this drives you to earn more, go earn more. Get a job at Google, get the 300k.

If that's not what you want then don't. You are earning a huge amount and are working at a well respected company. You are doing awesome. Seriously you're kicking ass.

Don't take this the wrong way but maybe it's time to grow up a little bit. You should not feel this bad because someone else is doing better than you. This is the definition of envy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy. Envy will rob you of so much happiness. Believe it or not you can learn to feel happy when other do better than you do. It will be a huge source of joy to you if you can learn this. It won't rob you of your drive. It will allow you to celebrate and be inspired by the success of others while being happy in who and where you are.

As a culture we used to denounce envy but now we embrace it, it's a truly destructive force.

Re: Ask HN: How do I feel better about working for Amazon?

#10
take a bit more pride in what you do. even your handle, lowiqengineer, says something about yourself. you internalize that and it affects you. it's already been said but stop comparing yourself to others. you don't need those perks, you don't even need that much money. find something bigger than that.
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