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Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#281

Post by augusto-moura »

crazygringo wrote: post #245
geophertz wrote: post #237

The thing is that if putting data centers underwater solves the cooling problem, all the heat produced is wasted, so it this really a good solution?

Heat is awfully hard to transfer in the first place, especially when it's not even that hot. It's handy if you can put your data center underneath a swimming pool, for example. But I'm not aware of any large-scale heat recovery projects from data centers. Data centers generally spend extra energy to remove the heat... But honestly who cares if your power comes from renewables in the first place -- solar and wind? It…

Well, you could put a sterling engine to transfer the heat to the ocean and generate energy back. This is exactly what some submarines do [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Applications_of_the_Stirling_e...

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#282

Post by Cerium »

HenryBemis wrote: post #208
ehsankia wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they patented it in 2017, I'm guessing it probably didn't make it in to this one, but the assumption is that the next version may have that technology.

That's a good enough reason to pull it out, replace/upgrade the equip, and drop it back in with the new setup (new sources of energy), and if they get the whole thing to transmit wireless-ly with a 1% failures per 2 years (8 out of the 855 servers) then it's a truly set-and-forget thing. And they can be bringing them up every 2-5-10 years to replace/upgrade the HW and drop it back in.

It would need an antenna buoy as wireless does not transmit well in salt water.

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#283

Post by chmod775 »

gregd wrote: post #247

Does anyone know what the environmental ramifications are of sinking presumably noisy and hot tubes into the ocean? I've been in server rooms and they aren't exactly quiet. The picture of the racks look to me like standard 1U servers.

Well, marine life is not going to give a damn about warm tubes. There's plenty of natural heat sources in the ocean way more extreme than that.

As for the noise, that can have a negative impact, but it's going to be nothing compared to the noise ships are making: https://www.npr.org/2020/07/20/891854646/whales-get-a-break-...

Whether it's high-pitched or low-pitched noise also makes a huge difference underwater.

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#284

Post by [deleted] »

nexuist wrote: post #129
RobRivera wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but this is such a 'goalpost' movement here that simply takes away a lot of context. The whole point of doing a dc underground is to reduce the hvac energy consumption which has a much larger ecological impact in terms of heat generated, power usage, potential greenhouse gas usage. The name of the game here is energy efficiency and conservation. Use less power by reducing power distribution loss at scale. W…

I don't think jacquesm is off the mark in asking these questions, especially: > what is the direct ecological impact of doing this at scale What is the impact on sea creatures if we put these giant heated cylinders in their territory? Is there any impact? I really doubt we have the answers yet. > at scale ...also implies that there will be more than one. So if one heat cylinder doesn't do anything, what about 10? 100…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#285

Post by swagasaurus-rex »

rhodo wrote: post #213
cmarschner wrote: post #212

I wonder how you would deal with theft and espionage for an underwater data center. The fact that no humans are around could be detrimental.

it wouldn't be too hard I don't think. It's a sealed tube so any attempts to get in could be detected with accelerometers or microphones.

Maybe easier to target the wires

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#286

Post by xf00 »

skosch wrote: post #117
freehunter wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if it wasn‘t for gravity, everything inside the atmosphere of planets and stars would be rushing to fill that vacuum. Nature abhors a vacuum, but that‘s only tempered by the fact that there are more powerful forces than vacuums.

That's not quite right. Even if there were no gravity or other forces, there would be no incentive for matter to go in one direction vs another, regardless of the distribution of matter around it. Over time you'd get a uniform-ish distribution, but that's a question of statistical mechanics, not one of pressure differences. On earth, matter only rushes to fill vacuums because the surrounding air or water pressure pus…

> but that's a question of statistical mechanics, not one of pressure differences.

My limited understanding was that 'pressure' is just a simplified way of speaking about statistical mechanics.

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#288

Post by sgarman »

aussieguy1234 wrote: post #287

If this type of data center is built and the location is kept secret, could it be protected in the event of nuclear war or some other catastrophe? So whatever happens, the internet will keep running

My first thought was to go after the weakest link, or the cables/connection in this case.

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#289

Post by smabie »

Dahoon wrote: post #256
crazygringo wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Heat is awfully hard to transfer in the first place, especially when it's not even that hot. It's handy if you can put your data center underneath a swimming pool, for example. But I'm not aware of any large-scale heat recovery projects from data centers. Data centers generally spend extra energy to remove the heat... But honestly who cares if your power comes from renewables in the first place -- solar and wind? It…

There are towns in Denmark getting heat from Google and Facebook datacenters so I don't see why it shouldn't work elsewhere. The way MS does it here the heat is 100% waste and should be taxed like other waste. Not to mention what about the noise? The sea is already noise polluted. Here's a source (in Danish). Wind energy in -> 25 MW/h of heat out (to heat up 12.000 houses): https://www.computerworld.dk/art/252732/fac…

You want to tax unused heat? Are you serious?

Re: Microsoft's underwater data centre resurfaces after two years

#290

Post by nonesuchluck »

chmod775 wrote: post #283
gregd wrote: post #247

Does anyone know what the environmental ramifications are of sinking presumably noisy and hot tubes into the ocean? I've been in server rooms and they aren't exactly quiet. The picture of the racks look to me like standard 1U servers.

Well, marine life is not going to give a damn about warm tubes. There's plenty of natural heat sources in the ocean way more extreme than that. As for the noise, that can have a negative impact, but it's going to be nothing compared to the noise ships are making: https://www.npr.org/2020/07/20/891854646/whales-get-a-break-... Whether it's high-pitched or low-pitched noise also makes a huge difference underwater.

They sunk it half a mile offshore and 117 feet deep. Hardly the abyssal zone. Other than hydrothermal vents, what natural heat sources are you thinking of?

(and yes, it's a damn shame the oceans are so noisy due to ships and sonar...and you're prob right about heat not being harmful, I'm just curious what you're referring to)

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