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Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

bbc.com

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Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#61

Post by growlist »

ForHackernews wrote: post #25
namdnay wrote: post #14

I'm always suspicious about carbon offsets. From what I've seen buying flights for example, the price seems surprisingly low. Either being carbon neutral is not as economy-killing as some say, or the true price is much higher. Does anyone have more expertise on this?

Because so few people are interested in offsets right now, there's a huge amount of "low-hanging fruit" options for cheap things humanity can do to offset carbon emissions. For example, look at some of the projects here: https://www.goldstandard.org/take-action/offset-your-emissio... Many of them just involve getting very poor people access to clean water (so they don't have to burn hydrocarbons to boil the water) or…

> cheap things humanity can do to offset carbon emissions

Contraception.

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#62

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

what_ever wrote: post #46
rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #41

This is like rich countries moving factories to third-world countries where industry emits more CO2. They pretend to be responsible for less and less greenhouse gases even though they consume more physical goods, with larger carbon footprint. Worst, they feel fine flying and buying SUV because their not that dirty compared to people in undeveloped countries whose carbon footprint keeps increasing.

I don't get the analogy - could you explain more? Disc: Googler.

I rephrased my comment (hopes it help). Another mediocre analogy on the subject that you may find both relevant and funny:

"I spread germs all over town today but I bought coronavirus offsets so we’re all good". via https://twitter.com/WeiZhangAtmos/status/1245890907511181312

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#63

Post by mlindner »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #47
namdnay wrote: post #14

I'm always suspicious about carbon offsets. From what I've seen buying flights for example, the price seems surprisingly low. Either being carbon neutral is not as economy-killing as some say, or the true price is much higher. Does anyone have more expertise on this?

Who told you going carbon neutral was economy killing? And if it is, why are all the world's governments commited to doing it? I think you can probably trace that information source back to someone who makes their money pumping CO2 into the atmosphere.

Because saying you're going to do it and actually doing it are different things? The former buys lots of votes, the latter not so much.

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#64

Post by thundergolfer »

Gys wrote: post #20
namdnay wrote: post #14

I'm always suspicious about carbon offsets. From what I've seen buying flights for example, the price seems surprisingly low. Either being carbon neutral is not as economy-killing as some say, or the true price is much higher. Does anyone have more expertise on this?

I always think the carbon offset offering for flights are only for peace of mind. I still have this mental note to look into it. I suspect prices include Value added Tax (around 20% in Europe) and a margin for the airline company. So not much left for a third party. And then I wonder how that is invested as well...

I looked into it a while ago after having my chosen airline tell me it'd cost $2 to offset, which sounds suspiciously cheap, and while I can't remember the exact third-party site I went to a remember their offset calculation being at least 10x greater.

I bet this is something that isn't regulated properly so we have Airlines straight up misleading customers about how much offsetting does cost.

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#65

Post by thepete2 »

fxtentacle wrote: post #55

... by installing fart filters for pigs. I kid you not: "The company tells me its offsets so far have focused mainly on capturing natural gas where it's escaping from pig farms and landfill sites."

I bet Google is really glad there are reckless, cheaply preventable greenhouse-gas emissions like that. And thank god no one has regulated it yet.

Otherwise you'd have to look at your OWN emissions, who wants to do that?

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#67

Post by hannob »

namdnay wrote: post #14

I'm always suspicious about carbon offsets. From what I've seen buying flights for example, the price seems surprisingly low. Either being carbon neutral is not as economy-killing as some say, or the true price is much higher. Does anyone have more expertise on this?

It's complicated.

For one, yeah, those offsetting companies calculate very generously. E.g. I once looked a bit into this and they make arguments like "we don't consider construction of the airport, because it's already there". The calculations for the offsets are also often calculated very generously, e.g. they often use the same mechanisms as the so-called Clean Development mechanism (which is part of the european emission trading system), which is known to overcalculate savings enormously.

The other thing is they offset things the cheapest way possible. That works as long as there are cheap ways to save carbon. It doesn't scale.

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#68

Post by boogies »

But at what cost? Alphabet pressures local governments to let them drain aquifers to cool their machines¹, and powers them using vast swaths of bulldozed former habitats of endangered desert tortoises and focused beams of light that literally burn alive thousands of birds:

Workers at a state-of-the-art solar plant in the Mojave Desert have a name for birds that fly through the plant’s concentrated sun rays — “streamers,” for the smoke plume that comes from birds that ignite in midair.

Federal wildlife investigators who visited the BrightSource Energy plant last year and watched as birds burned and fell, reporting an average of one “streamer” every two minutes, are urging California officials to halt the operator’s application to build a still-bigger version.².

1: https://www.postandcourier.com/news/google-s-controversial-g...

2: https://www.sbsun.com/2014/08/18/emerging-solar-plants-in-mo...

"Once built, U.S. government biologists found the plant's superheated mirrors were killing birds. In April, biologists working for the state estimated that 3,500 birds died at Ivanpah in the span of a year, many of them burned alive while flying through a part of the solar installment where air temperatures can reach 1,000 degrees Fahrenheit." — https://www.wsj.com/articles/high-tech-solar-projects-fail-t...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivanpah_Solar_Power_Facility#B...

Re: Google says its carbon footprint is now zero

#69

Post by qubex »

thepete2 wrote: post #65
fxtentacle wrote: post #55

... by installing fart filters for pigs. I kid you not: "The company tells me its offsets so far have focused mainly on capturing natural gas where it's escaping from pig farms and landfill sites."

I bet Google is really glad there are reckless, cheaply preventable greenhouse-gas emissions like that. And thank god no one has regulated it yet. Otherwise you'd have to look at your OWN emissions, who wants to do that?

Smells a bit rich, doesn’t it? ;)
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