Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation • Hacker News Board

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#151

Post by tomcam » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:46 AM UTC

jeffbee wrote: post #32

moneytide1 wrote: post #6

I saw a "Just Have A Think" YouTube channel video recently describing the 1MV HVDC line being built across China. It is part of Belt&Road infrastructure project and will allow them to distribute excess loads to different time zones without skin effect losses of an AC line. This is a part of their COVID stimulus injection. When American $1.2k per citizen landed in accounts, I remember checking local Walmarts in the we…

Really, you "checked local walmarts" to inventory all their televisions? That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've ever read, even on HN. According to the government, only 7% of recipients used any part of their stimulus money to buy household items. https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-9/receipt-and-use-of-sti...

> Really, you "checked local walmarts" to inventory all their televisions? That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've ever read, even on HN.

So you're a mindreader.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#152

Post by missedthecue » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:48 AM UTC

vlovich123 wrote: post #132

hliyan wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My hypothesis is that the US is a victim of its own success: several generations of living in a prosperous, stable society reduces the need for the average citizen to develop survival skills. Here I use the term 'survival skills' very generally: it includes specialized education and expertise in some area, financial planning and risk management skills, inter-personnel and conflict resolution skills, emotional resilie…

I think that’s an insane answer. We’ve divested in public schools over a prolonged period of time, plain and simple. The public schools that have not experienced that magically are in the wealthy “rich” neighborhoods. The system is working as intended. You want an educated population? Make sure schools have the proper investments. None of this 30 kids per classroom bullshit. Do 10-15 and see what kind of students you…

Public education spending as a percentage of GDP is at an all time high. I dont think people appreciate the cost of public schooling in the US. According to data provided by the federal government, public schools in the US spend on average $15,500 per child per year. That is an enormous amount of money and it is only climbing ever higher year after year.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#153

Post by missedthecue » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:50 AM UTC

jacobwilliamroy wrote: post #98

didibus wrote: post #19

> "America does not have enough people with those skills." Seriously, I feel the US has a big education problem, with part of it being cultural I think. Seems being educated, knowledgeable, having expertise, learning about science and technology, medicine and law, just isn't valued anymore, in fact it's almost being denigrated and shamed. What I see instead is people pushing for anti-intellectualism and valuing the "…

Having a dumb population means you can make lots of money for very little effort. Pet rocks? Million dollar idea. Water? As long as it's .00000000000000001% poison, it's a homeopathic remedy you can sell for $500 a vial. Add more water to make it more expensive. Ever think about using the equity in your home to consolidate your credit cards and other debts? Dumb dumbs spend more and expect less. Bad education is good…

I don't think this is a very good take. There is a very clear correlation between GNP and education level in nations.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#154

Post by ithkuil » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:52 AM UTC

turndown wrote: post #143

paganel wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> doctors, scientists, and professionals within certain fields are "in on it" and part of some big conspiracy to do some vague, undefined thing that'll take down America and corrupt their children. From my point of view I think that is a healthy reaction against technocracy, and it's not US-specific. Those "doctors, scientists, and professionals within certain fields" can't expect to take the decisions that influence…

I definitely agree with your central point that anyone can use any ideology to endorse their own personal beliefs, but it also has to be said that giving the same weight to the feelings of a person versus actual fact, spoken by an expert, is the literal degradation of our society.

Many people lack the necessary expertise to recognize an expert when they see one.

They thus are left to resort to authority as the proximate measure accessible to them to assess how much credit to assign to the opinions of a particular expert.

To complicate matters, there are documented cases where in the past half century at least experts have be bought by special interest groups such as big tobacco etc. This eroded public trust in any experts and many people were brought up assuming every public discourse with expert opinions is rigged. That generation now 40-50yo and their world view is having a certain weight on current matters. (Disclaimer: this is just my personal opinion, I'm not an expert. And even if I was many people wouldn't trust me anyway ;-p )

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#155

Post by asdff » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:52 AM UTC

Qwertious wrote: post #79

natmaka wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it an effect of a feeling caused by governments using experts in a way letting (too often and a too large part of) the public think that they, at worst, are all (gov & experts alike) pushing their own short-termed and only self-beneficial agendas or, at best, nearly always devise some "Grand Plan" which then appears to cost much more than budgeted, gives less than promised and has unwanted unexpected side-effec…

I wouldn't blame the government here, but the media. Their job is literally to represent experts and their true image to the general public - as in, they're supposed to research and tell us whether the expert seems credible, and if the government is lying about experts (or anything else) it's the media's job to call them out on it.

What can the media do when people would rather read a literal propaganda piece on facebook, watch some quack on fox news, listen to conspiracy theories on AM radio, or hear their preacher spew bigoted nonsense every sunday? We aren't taught how to continually educate ourselves about the world after school, so we would rather lean into things that confirm our biases rather than expand our perspective.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#156

Post by throw_m239339 » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:53 AM UTC

tomcam wrote: post #150

A reminder that Google's revenues come almost completely from ad technology that they bought (from Doubleclick, IIRC). Google has stuck its fingers into hundreds of pies since then, to its credit, and has found that innovation is difficult, unpredictable, and expensive.

Search, Maps, Ads and Android are Google's most successful product.

Android was bought at well.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#157

Post by donw » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:53 AM UTC

turndown wrote: post #143

paganel wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> doctors, scientists, and professionals within certain fields are "in on it" and part of some big conspiracy to do some vague, undefined thing that'll take down America and corrupt their children. From my point of view I think that is a healthy reaction against technocracy, and it's not US-specific. Those "doctors, scientists, and professionals within certain fields" can't expect to take the decisions that influence…

I definitely agree with your central point that anyone can use any ideology to endorse their own personal beliefs, but it also has to be said that giving the same weight to the feelings of a person versus actual fact, spoken by an expert, is the literal degradation of our society.

And then you get the Replication Crisis[1], in which we find that a shockingly large number of studies in the social sciences failed to meet the bar for scientific fact.

There are plenty of "actual facts", spoken by "experts", which a few years later turn out to be absolutely false.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replication_crisis

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#158

Post by dang » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:53 AM UTC

jeffbee wrote: post #32

moneytide1 wrote: post #6

I saw a "Just Have A Think" YouTube channel video recently describing the 1MV HVDC line being built across China. It is part of Belt&Road infrastructure project and will allow them to distribute excess loads to different time zones without skin effect losses of an AC line. This is a part of their COVID stimulus injection. When American $1.2k per citizen landed in accounts, I remember checking local Walmarts in the we…

Really, you "checked local walmarts" to inventory all their televisions? That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've ever read, even on HN. According to the government, only 7% of recipients used any part of their stimulus money to buy household items. https://www.bls.gov/opub/btn/volume-9/receipt-and-use-of-sti...

> That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've ever read, even on HN.

Please omit swipes like that from your HN comments. They break the site guidelines, and you owe the community better.

Your comment would be just fine without that bit.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#159

Post by ma2rten » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:57 AM UTC

arvinsim wrote: post #116

ma2rten wrote: post #38

I am not sure what he is talking about. I work on AI/Machine Learning and I can't think of any major paper that came out of China.

I am ignorant on this field so please indulge me with this question: Isn't in China's best interest not to make public any innovations that they can leverage against other countries?

Maybe if it was some kind of military technology. But Schmidt's quote is about publications and the article talks about civilian companies.

Re: Ex-Google boss Eric Schmidt: US 'dropped the ball' on innovation

#160

Post by hliyan » Sun, Sep 13, 2020, 6:59 AM UTC

vlovich123 wrote: post #132

hliyan wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My hypothesis is that the US is a victim of its own success: several generations of living in a prosperous, stable society reduces the need for the average citizen to develop survival skills. Here I use the term 'survival skills' very generally: it includes specialized education and expertise in some area, financial planning and risk management skills, inter-personnel and conflict resolution skills, emotional resilie…

I think that’s an insane answer. We’ve divested in public schools over a prolonged period of time, plain and simple. The public schools that have not experienced that magically are in the wealthy “rich” neighborhoods. The system is working as intended. You want an educated population? Make sure schools have the proper investments. None of this 30 kids per classroom bullshit. Do 10-15 and see what kind of students you…

Counterpoint: I grew up in a third world country where class room sizes were between 30-40. Facilities and teacher qualifications were spartan at best. Good textbooks cost an appreciable fraction of an average person's monthly income.