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Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

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131–140 of 241 posts

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#131

If you go to Switzerland it opens your eyes a bit - there's no plastic recycling, there's only PET plastic recycling. If the bottle/whatever is not PET, it's not recycleble and you have to buy special, taxed bag that's used for "everything else" that gets burned/whatever. PET plastic can be recycled to lower grade plastic used for outdoor mats etc.

It looks like this has changed in the last few years.

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#132
post #4

Reduce, reuse, recycle - meaning recycling is the last option. It's better to not consume plastic in the first place, but if you must, find additional uses for it. It takes more of a lifestyle change though than to simply put your cans in a different barrel. Which is probably why few people are willing to try it.

I'm not sure that judging people for not being sufficiently committed is going to save the planet. People are making money from doing this, and are going to protect their income. A pure lifestyle does make us feel better about ourselves, though.

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#133
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in an apartment complex, so we have different receptacles for each. But for single-family homes there are usually segmented so you have different subsections for each like this: https://www.rambo.se/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/fyrfackskrl-... When I lived in my last apartment I carried the glass/plastic/paper/cardboard and so on a block over to a public recycling station, so that was a lot less convenient but I…

What does the emptying collection process look like for one of those barrels? I can only assume someone comes by, manually opens the lid and by hand takes out each of the smaller containers one by one, and empties them into larger segregated collection containers. Is that true?

No, it's pretty much as automated as a "normal" one, see here for a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0WeV_9pS7I

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#134
post #105
post #83

Great. Can we also discuss now how recycling paper hurts climate? Modern landfills are airtight, so buried paper is sequestered carbon. Less buried paper - less sequestration.

isn't sequestering carbon a good thing?

I think that's what he tried to say, if you recycle paper the carbon gets somehow released. But, in theory, the recycled paper will still come out as paper, thus carbon will still be there.

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recycling is a hack to try to fix the downside of another hack. The other hack is that the cost of trash disposal is artificially depressed to reduce the incentive to dispose of refuse by illegal dumping. But this means refuse is overproduced. Recycling is an attempt to reduce this increased volume of refuse going into landfills. The better strategy would be to charge a fee, up front, for all goods that reflects thei…

A fee up-front like _taxes_ (VAT)? It is the government that subsidizes the disposal, and does it through the taxes that they charge everyone, so in fact exactly what you are saying it's happening. If the tax depended on e.g. volume of packaging vs volume of content, or weight of packaging vs weight of content, that might be a different story and more useful. But even then not all trash is done equal, a paper envelop…

> a paper envelope or cardboard is way better than a plastic one, even if it's bigger/heavier.

Why is it better? Because the plastic comes from fossil fuels that cause CO2 emissions? The solution there is a CO2 tax on fossil fuels, not trying to special case the waste disposal fee.

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#136

I'm sick of stupid people. This was never a secret. If you were dumb enough to think recycling works for anything other than aluminium you are the problem. Penn and Tell even did a Bullshit, for pre internet times. https://m.imdb.com/title/tt0771119/ ( although it was a awful episode )

Yeah, people have all the time in the world to independently research recycling technologies. I'm pretty sure you yourself don't have that time, you rely on cynicism and a few experts you trust. How are they all supposed to know your experts, and why should they trust them more than the vast majority of public experts on the payroll of polluters?

People have to work and raise their children. They can't be expected to be experts on things that the government, media, and scientists are actively trying to deceive them about.

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#137
Just thought I would share an album I made from a trip to a Bay Area recycling facility. I shot a bunch of slow mo of recycling machinery.

It’s pretty crazy that they can’t sort black plastic because the machine relies on IR light to sense plastic type. We’ve got all these machine learning engineers in the area and probably not so many of them are working on real practical solutions to problems like trash sorting.

https://imgur.com/gallery/IK5zKkO

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't we running out of sand too? https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20191108-why-the-world-is...

We’re running out of beach and construction sand, which needs to be somewhat coarse to be functional. Desert sand particles are too fine, alkali content is too high, and is generally full of contaminants.

Yes, there are entire mafias operating in the sand business, stealing it wherever they can.

There's the documentary Sand Wars that highlights the issues: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sand_Wars

Al Jazeera aired a docu about it too (don't know if it was the same one): https://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/specialseries/2017/12/s...

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#139

Um, what's the deal with editing the headline? The original asserts a statement. It may or may not be true. But why would it benefit HN readers to turn this assertion into a question?

no deal - the submission bookmarklet JS[1] automatically fills in the title from the html meta:

    Is Plastic Recycling A Lie? Oil Companies Touted  Recycling To Sell More Plastic : NPR

[1] javascript:window.location=%22https://news.ycombinator.com/submitlink?u=%22+encodeURICompo...

Re: Oil Companies Touted Recycling to Sell More Plastic

#140
post #10

It is always a little surprising how naive people are when it comes to recycling. The majority of the cost and difficulty comes in sorting. Back in the good old days most US municipalities used to require people to sort their recycling by type, but over the years we have switched to a more wasteful system. For aluminum cans the material is valuable and relatively easy to sort. For plastic the material is cheap and so…

Why are we always blaming the public for being easily deceived and not the people who invest large sums of financial and political capital in the deception?

Partly, because the deception worked. Partly, because tech crowds lean libertarian, and interpreting all issues as individual issues requiring individual solutions is a very libertarian response.
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