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I Want to Fix Goodreads

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Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#11

How do people build recommendation engines? Like, even when you have access to the site's entire API and can write your own client for it, there's still the fact that their recommendations are generally better. It sounds like an extremely important value-add. There are many sites that I will only use the app for because that is where the recommendations are shown. But to me taking a user profile and an article and sp…

There's an entire research field about Recommender Systems (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recommender_system) with its own conference series (https://recsys.acm.org/).

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#12

How do people build recommendation engines? Like, even when you have access to the site's entire API and can write your own client for it, there's still the fact that their recommendations are generally better. It sounds like an extremely important value-add. There are many sites that I will only use the app for because that is where the recommendations are shown. But to me taking a user profile and an article and sp…

I get the sense that part of the problem with book recs vs. YouTube video recs is that you can evaluate the quality of a video recommendation super quickly (click in, find out like 10 seconds in that you don't care for it, click out).

With books, actioning a recommendation involves

1) getting a copy of the book (digital or physical, both cost money or at minimum the time required to pirate),

2) starting to read it (with the sunken cost of time and/or money + the drive to "give it a chance" both looming over your shoulder, costing you more time),

3) eventually either getting to the end or swallowing your pride and bailing.

I think you'd start to see actually useful systems here if you could even eliminate step 1; make it easy as clicking in from a recommendation directly into reading mode.

Also solves a critical issue for the engine: gauge recommendation quality by how soon people click out of the rec, as opposed to waiting for the user to go through steps 1-3, and care enough to come back and provide a rating. Way more data to work with.

Of course, this all skirts the Actual Problem: the amount of IP law you'd have to trudge through in making enough books this accessible.

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#13
post #12

How do people build recommendation engines? Like, even when you have access to the site's entire API and can write your own client for it, there's still the fact that their recommendations are generally better. It sounds like an extremely important value-add. There are many sites that I will only use the app for because that is where the recommendations are shown. But to me taking a user profile and an article and sp…

I get the sense that part of the problem with book recs vs. YouTube video recs is that you can evaluate the quality of a video recommendation super quickly (click in, find out like 10 seconds in that you don't care for it, click out). With books, actioning a recommendation involves 1) getting a copy of the book (digital or physical, both cost money or at minimum the time required to pirate), 2) starting to read it (w…

I also recently googled a quote, found it in a specific page in a book hosted on https://www.pagebypagebooks.com/, and just impulsively clicked through the whole book because it happened to capture my interest, and only "demanded" that I commit to a single page at a time. Hard to explain, but it felt more natural in that every-page-is-a-URL format to trivially bail at any page, without the weird apprehension I get from the same action in an e-reader / physical book.

The website is super old/limited, but if all books were that trivial to access + click through, I think we'd see something more interesting here. Made me wonder how hard it'd be to convert the entirety of Project Gutenberg into that sort of Web 1.0 format automatically.

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#14
post #7
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that hard. See for instance https://www.coursera.org/lecture/machine-learning/collaborat... on how to get started

It's not hard to build something that gives you recommendations. It extremely difficult to build something that works well. For consumer companies I know only Spotify and TikTok that do it well, and Youtube that does it OK-ish.

I personally wouldn’t say that Spotify does it well. I don’t think I’ve ever gotten a good recommendation. And daily playlists are a mess.

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#17
> My idea for an 11-star experience 1 in finding new books is that Goodreads knows me even better than I know myself and constantly recommends the perfect book.

> goodreads shows me five books that I don’t want to read.

I wonder if these two ideas are at odds with each other. Imagine for a moment that recommendation engines were solved problems, and definitely worked given the above statement. They know you better than you know yourself. Would it’s recommendations likely only include books that you obviously wanted to read? Or would they include books you didn’t know you wanted or needed to read? I mean this in terms of judging the books by their cover rather knowing about their existence. Isn’t it likely or even probable that the majority of books recommended would be based on the value they contribute to something deeper than the pure enjoyment purposes?

As an aside, I remember in a college literature class I took the instructor told us that it’s up to the reader to derive value or meaning from stories. This was a class that studied short stories of early American authors. Most of which were slice of life narratives that didn’t have any apparent meaning, or commentary from the authors themselves. The exercise was to study the characters, scenery and tone and try derive what might either lie beneath the words or story themselves. Whether the ideas we deduced from the stories were accurate (and in most cases probably were not) the value Of the process was of critical thinking about the stories that made us consider and express ideas and beliefs we normally don’t.

Back on topic, would a working recommendation engine likely suggest things that on the surface seemed either boring or blatantly unappealing that would provide tremendous value if we put work in to reading and studying?

That being said, is it possible that current recommendation engines are already working? Most are at least driven by reading behaviors of the masses, so it seems like it might be feasible that that Steven king book that is unappealing to you is something you should actually read.

(This is not including recommendations for books you have already read in different languages which seems like an obvious bug, but then again reading books you’ve already read in different languages might be an excellent way to become more fluent in a new language or gain a deeper understanding of translation of ideas between languages....)

So, maybe the tech isn’t something that needs to be fixed. Maybe we just need to be open to what the tech is telling us?

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#18
I am a Goodreads employee. this is a burner account. i could be fired for posting.

we love Goodreads and we know it is bad today. we are working to fix it. there are very few of us. we are trying. we are making big changes soon.

Re: I Want to Fix Goodreads

#20

I am a Goodreads employee. this is a burner account. i could be fired for posting. we love Goodreads and we know it is bad today. we are working to fix it. there are very few of us. we are trying. we are making big changes soon.

Best of luck and thank you.
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