Live data from Hacker News

Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

bloomberg.com

31–40 of 298 posts

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#31

Really sucks being young 20s. Between climate and the looming covid recession, is there even a point to planning for the future? Seems like the world will be trashed before I'm anywhere close to retirement anyway, almost like I might as well enjoy my money while I can do things with it.

This might be instructive reading re: the plan you alluded to lower in your comments: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lotus_Eater

Can’t find text online but it’s a good story. Most humans want to live when older, even if circumstances bad.

As for the future, you may consider a few things:

1. What will happen of everyone sensible to problems lives a life of empty hedonism? Rather than trying to improve them.

2. Will the change really happen so fast that death will be preferable? See the story above. Young you can not reliably plan for what older you will consider early of living.

3. Certainly your analysis cautions against working to death in a job you hate to enjoy it all at 65. But, that plan is not a good idea even if the world at 65 is paradise. These are your most capable years and it makes sense to enjoy them.

In my own case, I worked really hard for about three years, built a working business, and now work a moderate amount on it. (I mean really hard. Sacrificing three years can be rational, sacrificing 30-40 is not. And I still did some memorable things in that time, like travel)

The other option is to pick some work which is moderately enjoyable, and leaves ample free time and mental space to pursue your interests.

Or work you love for itself.

But again, I fail to see what the end of the world does to either of these calculations. In my view the hate your life then retire then die was obsolete regardless.

However, there is a fourth option that presents itself regarding the future apocalypse: work against it. For instance, if you have the technical skills, there is a booming field in renewable energy or carbon extraction.

What about animals specifically? Current nature reserves exist because people in the past decided to make them. You can be part of making one.

Or you can make a lot of money and fund these causes directly.

If everybody gives up hope then hope is lost. My expected future scenario is so grim it startles my parents. But I also think we could still avert much of and it’s worth trying.

As for the recession, that’s far too short term to worry about. If you’re posting here you surely have the skills to avoid it. I came into the market through the 2008-09 recession. Statistically, it was worse for my cohort, but my friends are doing just fine. It lowers results on average, but that doesn’t mean all individual results are disastrous.

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#32
post #18

I guess it was alluded to in the article but my main concern is the amount of fertilizers, herbicides, and pesticides we use. As we clear more land for Ag we are of course limiting habitat for animals but also zapping them constantly with these chemicals. Fertilizers get into water and decimate the life in there. Herbicides coupled with pesticides decimate insect ecosystems. The development of land gives larger anima…

But we also don't even take the most basic actions to prevent that fertilizer from making it into our waterways. Farmers insist on putting in thousands of miles of drain tile and running it straight into creeks and streams. They plow their fields right up to the very edge of marshes and streams instead of leaving grass strips to act as a barrier to runoff. It's shocking how little people seem to realize or care about the fact we can't even handle minute changes to help mother nature. The ironic part being, at least around here, every year some group spends millions and millions of dollars on "Farmer's Care" commercials and billboards.

Also, not trying to be a grammar nazi - I just appreciate when people point things out to me so take it in that spirit.

Alluded to - eluded means you're evading/escaping something.

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#33
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For us, not really. The generations that come after us? Probably. And therein lies the problem. The people making the rules and pulling the strings don't have a bleeding, burning pressure to change course. And they won't until it's too late. Complain all you want about climate and biodiversity and pollution, but nothing is going to be done until we've stunted the lives of the people at the top. That's just how the sh…

I started to change my bevahiour. I stopped buying fruit and vegetables in plastic wrapping. I buy milk in glass or paper containers. In my household I pay super close attention to how much water is running when we do dishes. We fill up the sink and wash it there. We turn off lights wherever possible and use energy efficient devices. I only bought A++ electrical kitchen appliances, we invested in a new energy efficie…

Not sure why you're getting downvoted, my guess is the reference to COVID.

The earth is currently overpopulated for the system we have in-place to feed it. We are very inefficient in resource usage and waste over 1/2 the food we produce each year. COVID isn't the answer to this problem, but your point is valid.

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If you invest now and prepare for a dystopian future you will be well prepared when and if it arrives" I mean this is what I'm talking about, who cares about living in a dystopia future. Surely it's better to go all in on enjoying the world now for 10 or 20 years than desperately try to carve out a maybe somewhat tolerable middle aged life in a dystopia. At least I'll have good company at the bottom in the future

Sure, but I don't think you or me will experience any dystopian future. Such a future is still far from being here and we will most likely die before that happens. But I guess it's different ideologies, by going "all in" as you suggest you simply add haste and helps to ensure that such a dystopian future is actually going to become reality. I am on the other hand preparing, trying to become self sustainable and lower…

> Sure, but I don't think you or me will experience any dystopian future. Such a future is still far from being here and we will most likely die before that happens.

This must be subjective, since to me it is most certainly already here and just intensifying, rapidly.

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#35

In addition, no one today remembered why the war had come about or who, if anyone, had won. The dust which had contaminated most of the planet's surface had originated in no country and no one, even the wartime enemy, had planned on it. First, strangely, the owls had died. At the time it had seemed almost funny, the fat, fluffy white birds lying here and there, in yards and on streets; coming out no earlier than twil…

“What we are facing now is a person whose crime dwarfs all of the crimes ever committed in human history. We were unable to find a single law applicable to his crime. So we recommend that the crime of Extinction of Life on Earth be added to international law ...”

— Cixin Liu, The Dark Forest

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#36
I saw a figure[1] the other day that blew me away. If you exclude pets and livestock, then human beings comprise ~90% of all mammals (by weight).

All wild whales, bears, lions, deer, moose, mice, rabbits, wild horses, camels, beavers, buffalo, elephants, tigers, rhinos, chimpanzees, pandas, goats, etc... are in that remaining 10%.

[1]: https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2018/5/29/17386112/al...

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If you invest now and prepare for a dystopian future you will be well prepared when and if it arrives" I mean this is what I'm talking about, who cares about living in a dystopia future. Surely it's better to go all in on enjoying the world now for 10 or 20 years than desperately try to carve out a maybe somewhat tolerable middle aged life in a dystopia. At least I'll have good company at the bottom in the future

Sure, but I don't think you or me will experience any dystopian future. Such a future is still far from being here and we will most likely die before that happens. But I guess it's different ideologies, by going "all in" as you suggest you simply add haste and helps to ensure that such a dystopian future is actually going to become reality. I am on the other hand preparing, trying to become self sustainable and lower…

At the very least, even if a full government dystopia hasn't happened, the environment will be almost gone. Even if the headline is off by a huge amount its not like we're slowing the course. We're going full steam ahead on overfishing and destroying coral reefs, I made a comment not too long ago on here about noticing there no longer being lightning bugs during summer where I live. Even my dad has stories of pulling over on the highway because bugs have encrusted his windshield, something I can't imagine. I rather enjoy hiking, I'd like to get my full while there's still things to see I guess. I can respect you're decision to lessen your impact, definetely, but I can't see enough people doing that to stop anything

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started to change my bevahiour. I stopped buying fruit and vegetables in plastic wrapping. I buy milk in glass or paper containers. In my household I pay super close attention to how much water is running when we do dishes. We fill up the sink and wash it there. We turn off lights wherever possible and use energy efficient devices. I only bought A++ electrical kitchen appliances, we invested in a new energy efficie…

Wait what? “I also stopped worrying about COVID and wearing masks and keeping social distance. If humans are weak and die from a begnin virus then it's part of the circle of life. Keeping everyone alive through unsustainable measures only harms our planet due to over population and further exploitation.” Benign?

Yes, humans in previous generations wouldn't even bat an eyelid at the death rates. it wasn't long ago that people used to willingly go on boat journeys even though 10% of the passengers would typically die on the way

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#39

In addition, no one today remembered why the war had come about or who, if anyone, had won. The dust which had contaminated most of the planet's surface had originated in no country and no one, even the wartime enemy, had planned on it. First, strangely, the owls had died. At the time it had seemed almost funny, the fat, fluffy white birds lying here and there, in yards and on streets; coming out no earlier than twil…

I've had this book on my shelf for a couple of years. I was put off it because I finally saw the film (and the remake) and didn't like them. Especially the remake, fell asleep trying to get through that film on three seperate occasions before giving up on it.

But I need to give the book a chance if it's quite different to the film.

Re: Animal Populations Fell by 68% in 50 Years and It’s Getting Worse

#40
post #28

Mandatory xkcd: https://xkcd.com/1338/ That was a real eye-opener when I first saw it. Talk about Anthropocene...

I doubt that includes insects, bacteria and krill

Krill biomass alone is significantly bigger than humanity's. Insect's and bacteria too.

This article discusses a study that claims humanity is ~1/10000 of total biomass, including plants. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/humans-make-110000...

In general large animals have been already devastated by the last ice age and then changes resulting from that. Even without humans large animals would be significantly less diverse than in many periods before.

Of course human's killing spree is not helping either.

The xkcd article is probably about large animals, but that's a kind of large animal chauvinism. Why do the small guys not matter? Yes they're in decline too

Post reply on HN