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Why Karachi Floods

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Re: Why Karachi Floods

#21

Post by tegeek »

hardly_a_mirage wrote: post #16
tegeek wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since early 1980s, Karachi city is not under PPP govt. So it really doesn't matter how corrupt Pakistan Peoples Party is, Karachi has not been voting for them for nearly 40 years now. It is always MQM with some coalition who runs Karachi. Right now PPP has only 3 NA seats from Karachi.

MQM and the Mayor is still waiting to receive a mandate from the provincial government. All power lies with the PPP in Karachi.

MQM and coalition was brought in power in 1983. Since then PPP has no mandate, they have no power to run the city. There are no funds available to any PPP representative in Karachi. All development or non-development projects run by the City administration. It is always the winning parties who decide about city development. How come a party which doesn't have any significant representation in city administration for 40 years is responsible for its development??? Karachi's city administration has been receiving one of the largest funds than any other city in Pakistan.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#22

Post by baybal2 »

tegeek wrote: post #21
hardly_a_mirage wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MQM and the Mayor is still waiting to receive a mandate from the provincial government. All power lies with the PPP in Karachi.

MQM and coalition was brought in power in 1983. Since then PPP has no mandate, they have no power to run the city. There are no funds available to any PPP representative in Karachi. All development or non-development projects run by the City administration. It is always the winning parties who decide about city development. How come a party which doesn't have any significant representation in city administration for…

I find no merit in discussing on whom, PPP, or MQM, to throw the blame on for Karachi situation. The result will largely be the same if you swap them. Both Karachi (MQM's turf,) and rural Sindh (PPP's turf) are ran terribly bad.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#23

Post by brazzy »

> Meanwhile, a solid waste recycling industry, mostly in the informal sector, developed in Karachi over the years. [...] The contractors organising this activity pay the Karachi Municipal Corporation (KMC) staff to not pick up the garbage so that the picking can be made easier.

> solid waste has been used for reclaiming land from the sea for both low income and elite residential purposes. Such reclamation is, strictly speaking, illegal in both cases. Informal developers informally arrange for KMC trucks to deposit their solid waste on the mangrove marshes and hire KMC tractors to spread and compact it.

Whoa. That's some next level corruption. Where it actually starts to supply infrastructure that should exist legally but apparently doesn't.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#24

Post by baybal2 »

aleem wrote: post #17

The problem, as with all things in Karachi, is systemic. It results from lack of ownership which makes accountability hard (politicized institutions with diverging agendas). During these rains, an entire township (Naya Nazimabad) sank underwater and many areas are still waterlogged. This township was built on top of a low-lying lake that was reclaimed. The approval of such projects involves dozens of authorities, eac…

What made it different this time is that chick housing in DHA, and Clifton got flooded, and people living there can shout loud enough for the establishment to care

Unless this, common people wouldn't be so happy seeing DHA residents swimming.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#25

Post by sumedh »

baybal2 wrote: post #14

Cantonments need to be abolished, and stricken out from the law. It's a colonial anachronism used int the past to shield British military from the local jurisdiction. Now they just add to complete jurisdictional—topological clusterf__k. The same is for governments of other city's subdivisions. The lion share of Karachi's troubles is from super unclear jurisdiction over much of its function, with each player in local…

Some Indian cities have Cantonments, I used to live in one such city. The roads in the cantonment were in better condition compared to the city roads and cantonments areas are much cleaner and well maintained compared to the city parts.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#26

Post by baybal2 »

sumedh wrote: post #25
baybal2 wrote: post #14

Cantonments need to be abolished, and stricken out from the law. It's a colonial anachronism used int the past to shield British military from the local jurisdiction. Now they just add to complete jurisdictional—topological clusterf__k. The same is for governments of other city's subdivisions. The lion share of Karachi's troubles is from super unclear jurisdiction over much of its function, with each player in local…

Some Indian cities have Cantonments, I used to live in one such city. The roads in the cantonment were in better condition compared to the city roads and cantonments areas are much cleaner and well maintained compared to the city parts.

In context of Pakistan, a cantonment is still is what is defined by the 1924 Cantonment Act, and not just a geographical connotation. As I understand, in India, a place may well be called a cantonment for historical reasons only, while being a regular town/city/district for administrative purposes.

And that law is defining it very, very poorly, and it is where the trouble with them comes from. Per the Act, a cantonment is “any place … in which any part of the regular forces or the regular air force of Pakistan is quartered … or is required for the service of such forces…”

Now decide on the boundary of the “any place,” which has never been historically defined, and delineations of jurisdictions with non cantoned off area.

Some cantonments never had defined boundaries, and grew to size of cities. Some, on other hand, began to envelop more and more of its host cities' area as definitions of their boundaries were reinterpreted.

Another matter is whether garbage removal, or provision of other utilities in a cantonment a duty of its own cantonal authority, or a region/county/city hosting it?

People who wrote that law wrote it before even electricity was a thing, and never though of such things.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#27

Post by screye »

sumedh wrote: post #25
baybal2 wrote: post #14

Cantonments need to be abolished, and stricken out from the law. It's a colonial anachronism used int the past to shield British military from the local jurisdiction. Now they just add to complete jurisdictional—topological clusterf__k. The same is for governments of other city's subdivisions. The lion share of Karachi's troubles is from super unclear jurisdiction over much of its function, with each player in local…

Some Indian cities have Cantonments, I used to live in one such city. The roads in the cantonment were in better condition compared to the city roads and cantonments areas are much cleaner and well maintained compared to the city parts.

Indian armed-forces cantonments are amazing. Practically the best place to live in India.

Incredible schooling, all the resources you need and a level of security that provides a ton of freedom.

I can practically pick out someone who has grown up on a cantonment. Everything from their demeanor, breadth of skills and a very special kind of cynical liberalism immediately gives it away.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#28

Post by HeXetic »

I understand this is a fairly technical article but I really wish there were photos of the drainage and sewage systems being talked about, particularly with respect to the clogging and illegal infill/building, instead of just pictures of Karachi's of flooded roads. It would really help to visualize just how much of the planned/built flood control flows have been compromised by corrupt development.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#29

Post by ashtonkem »

baybal2 wrote: post #20
actuator wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't the cantonment just function like its own local body working alongside the other local bodies, with proportionate allocation of budget? I understand with the influence the defence establishment wields in the affairs, it has a greater say but isn't it in their interest to keep the financial hub of their country healthy.

Ideally, they should be, but there are just too many administrative divisions already, and adding 6+ more to them will not do good. There is a need to dramatically simplify the "topology" of Karachi's government. As it is now, just finding out who orders whom in Karachi is neigh impossible. One needs a special talent to think of a government system this convoluted.

Sounds like the ancien régime in pre revolutionary France; the absolute mess of tangled powers, rights, obligations, and jurisdictions made well meaning reform almost impossible, and gave untold ammunition to those more interested in obstructionism to maintain the status quo.

Re: Why Karachi Floods

#30

Post by pythonbase »

The systematic encroachment, lack of infrastructure development/ maintenance and criminal negligence by the concerned authorities have turned Karachi into an urban disaster. Every time it rains, Karachi sinks.

Here's a blog post from 2009, things have became worse now.

http://www.chowrangi.pk/why-karachi-suffer-when-it-rains.htm...

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