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Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

cnet.com

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Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#531

Post by askvictor »

Waterluvian wrote: post #291

One thing I wish I could make my childless peers grok is that THERE IS NO VACATION when you have young kids. I’m taking this week off and people speak as if I’m on vacation. Please please hear my words literally: my job is my break. Weekends are more physically and intellectually exhausting than weekdays when I get to $&@# off to work for eight hours. My paid time off is a way to give us a fighting chance at laundry…

Yeah, I'm surprised the headline isn't the other way around: "parents increasingly resentful of their childless peers"

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#532

Post by klmadfejno »

treeman79 wrote: post #170
eyesbear wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did your kid like the cat you drew?

Cat in question https://ibb.co/ZVfjzB3

This cat is so high quality that it changes my reaction of the situation from empathetic and concerned to optimistic and impressed. I think there is nothing heartbreaking about your situation if you're dropping cats of this caliber to anonymous door notes.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#533

Post by TedShiller »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #4

I am a middle-aged adult with no children who's worked at tech firms for the past couple decades. To be honest, the "resentment" of those without children have for "benefits" those with children get strikes me as extremely selfish, immature and displaying a total lack of empathy. This is time off specifically to take care of children, something now that has become exceedingly more difficult in Covid times. What's nex…

I fully support those with children as well, including all the extra benefits, flexibility, and compensation needed to raise healthy children. I think this is great for all involved, including those parents, children, and society at large.

The part that's missing is that childless workers should get the same benefits, flexibility, and compensation as workers with children, so that they can handle challenging and complex elements of their own lives that are no less complicated, challenging, expensive, or time consuming than having children.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#534

Post by recursive »

devit wrote: post #458
jacquesm wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Woodworking is a hobby. Raising kids is a full time job, no time off, no pay, no changing jobs.

It's possible to put up the kids for adoption, or more practically aborting them in advance.

That's a hot take. I think a lot (almost all?) parents would rather lose their jobs that put their kids up for adoption. And abortion is only possible prior to birth. Most of the parents we're talking about now had kids prior to covid even being a thing.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#535

Post by ftlio »

falcolas wrote: post #171
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #4

I am a middle-aged adult with no children who's worked at tech firms for the past couple decades. To be honest, the "resentment" of those without children have for "benefits" those with children get strikes me as extremely selfish, immature and displaying a total lack of empathy. This is time off specifically to take care of children, something now that has become exceedingly more difficult in Covid times. What's nex…

> the "resentment" of those without children have for "benefits" those with children get strikes me as extremely selfish, immature and displaying a total lack of empathy. Unpopular opinion: We should not be rewarding or elevating people for having unprotected sex without the support network to take care of their children in the event they are unable to attend school. There's a thousand reasons a child might not be ab…

Of the hundred+ billion humans to ever live, practically none of them were planned. Children will come, and their ability to thrive is a commons. Moralizing the decisions people make that result in kids is my goto example of how poorly a decision can be made when you defy data.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#536

Post by recursive »

mike_d wrote: post #524
Waterluvian wrote: post #291

One thing I wish I could make my childless peers grok is that THERE IS NO VACATION when you have young kids. I’m taking this week off and people speak as if I’m on vacation. Please please hear my words literally: my job is my break. Weekends are more physically and intellectually exhausting than weekdays when I get to $&@# off to work for eight hours. My paid time off is a way to give us a fighting chance at laundry…

That is called life. There is no vacation when you have a sick spouse, or bought a new house, or are in a car accident. Your job shouldn't be your break, regardless of your situation. My wife is at a FAANG company currently covering for 4 people who all get double digit weeks off because they chose to have children. Does she get any time off for literally working 18 hour days 7 days a week? No of course not.

> Your job shouldn't be your break, regardless of your situation.

If it's less stressful that the ambient level in your life, then it's a break. Why shouldn't it be?

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#537

Post by zajio1am »

jacquesm wrote: post #164
luckylion wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They are working as much or more. Just not on the same things. The same can be said about anyone with a hobby though. They are working as much or more. Just not on the same things.

Kids are a hobby?

I guess that most people have children not for societal duty to continue human species, but for personal emotional fulfilment. So in this sense they are hobby.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#538

Post by jajsd3udf »

wayneftw wrote: post #153
tbatchelli wrote: post #57

How much of this issue is related to having a part of the population think that people having children is solely a private question? "You had children, why should I bear your burden!" If none of us had children there would d be no economy to support anyone's life in, let's say, 40 years from now. People making and raising new sane and healthy people should be considered a social and common good, for the sake of all,…

I’ve always thought that people should need to get a license to have a baby. You need a license to pull fish out of a river or to plant bamboo in your own yard, but any moron is allowed to make new people. How does that make any sense? With a baby license, hopefully we would actually only make new sane, healthy people - currently that’s not happening because the world is chock full of unhealthy idiots that I don’t wa…

I would turn this idea around: instead of barring certain people from reproducing (which has obvious issues), a society could require that all new parents take a course, go through counseling, or something like that, after which if they're deemed unfit to provide a healthy and safe environment the newborn would have to be adopted. This assumes it can be done to no economic cost to the new parents. It also assumes there are uncontroversial ways to determine fitness to parent. Basically a similar system to what most countries have in place for dealing with children in distress, but proactive rather than reactive. I'm sure there are issues with this idea as well, and the pragmatic way of trying to educate prospective parents is probably the best we can do, but it seems worth exploring.

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#539

Post by mike_d »

umeshunni wrote: post #289
johnjj257 wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this analogy is that everyone uses the school system at some point in their life, but not everyone is a parent at some point.

But everyone was a child at some point

My parents never got time off to just take care of me. I was on my own. Do I get a refund or a credit? Maybe a vacation voucher?

Re: Tech firms face growing resentment of parent employees during Covid-19

#540

Post by baddox »

jdm2212 wrote: post #274
nicbou wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't fully agree with you. Back when I worked in retail or fast food, smokers could step out for a 5 minute smoke break every once in a while. As a non-smoker, I wasn't allowed to just sit there for 5 minutes. At the end of the day, we got paid the same, but smokers got 30 minutes off, courtesy of the non-smokers who picked up the slack. Likewise, parents are excused from work because they have children. I fully a…

Someone has to provide the goods and services you'll consume when you're old. Those people are today's kids, whose parents are doing you a big favor at considerable expense to themselves. Raising children isn't like smoking, a hobby, a side hustle, or other miscellaneous personal obligations. It's more like military service and jury duty -- an essential service that some people perform to ensure that society as we kn…

That makes it sound like raising children isn't already an extremely strong biological urge and something that tends to provide immense satisfaction to parents. If parents didn't receive special benefits at work to help them raise children, or if all adults were given comparable benefits regardless of whether they have children, I don't think that would shatter the incentive structure and result in having too few humans the next generation.

It's really not like military service or jury duty: things which in most cases people do not have an extremely strong biological urge to do.

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