Live data from Hacker News

Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

arstechnica.com

51–60 of 140 posts

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a solid technical reason for that though, as ISPs have no control over the performance of your connection's remote part. Sure, it leaves plenty of room for abuse, but this is a necessary disclaimer, not some slippery marketing.

Does anyone in the US actually get the “up to” even plugging directly into the ISP provided modem at off peak times?

Yes, absolutely. On all 5 different sites I manage in fact, two on a local ISP ADSL, third on local ISP fiber, fourth on Comcast Business cable modem, and even the fifth on a small regional WISP. All of them are reliably within a few percent of their expected speed with about the frequency that one would reasonably expect from that connection class. "Up-to" is fuzzy but quite justified with many technologies. Proper fiber of course is rock solid and essentially never has issues short of a backhoe. But ADSL falls off hard with distance, and a lot of the in-house wiring it's forced through is ancient garbage phone line. Sometimes one can get a huge practical boost just from shortening/replacing line with cat 5. And WISPs obviously have to deal with inclement weather fade as well as any additional obstacles for subpar sites that customers can't/won't rectify. Cable is more of a shared resource though you get much better support and less bullshit with business class even though Comcast are bastards.

Now, I absolutely would love to see it mandated by law that somewhere upfront in ISP info to consumers it's required to have a standardized SLA. A consumer-level SLA for sure, but still have it formalized and cover all of the basics. So not just absolute max bandwidth, but 90%/50%/whatever bandwidth, any guaranteed floor, 90% latency, any data caps, any throttling criteria, etc. All categories the same and measured in a mandated standardized way so universally comparable. I don't expect data center level SLAs at all, but there isn't any reason there can't be that level of clarity.

But residential/SOHO and such service inherently has more uncertainty and more compromises and capacity multipliers to meet lower prices. I think that's ok, just that it should be laid out and not buried in some fine print or support page in the disused lavatory defended by a leopard either.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#52
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ideally these people would be buying based on those actual metrics, rather than the RPM as a proxy for them, if that's what they really wanted, but I don’t know if that’s on the data sheets. Power use and acoustics are listed in WD datasheets, but I guess they might not be well comparable to values from other manufacturers.

> Power use and acoustics are listed in WD datasheets Given the fact that they lied about RPM on their datasheets, why should anyone believe other pieces of information on their datasheets are correct?

They seem to have lied elsewhere like in store pages (per other HN comments), but the datasheets specifically only mention "Performance Class" being "5400 RPM Class", which may be misleading but is not a lie IMO.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#53

After all this news of false advertisement and lower quality drives from WD, I'm glad I bought Seagate drives, even if only because Amazon had a big fat discount on Barracudas the day I was shopping for some spinning rust.

I wouldn't touch a Barracuda with a WD SMR drive duct taped to a 50' pole. The only way to get good hard drives these days is to buy from the enterprise lines e.g. WD Gold or Seagate Exos. They're extremely expensive, but this is the only way to get the kind of quality that used to be standard a few years ago.

Why not get an external hard drive and shuck it? You end up paying half the price, but the drive is still the same (although you have to pay attention to reviews on /r/DataHoarder). The only disadvantage is the lack of warranty and having to shuck it.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#54
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

60 watt equivalent light bulb

I thought that based on the amount of lumens it produces

It is, and that's the point: you can screw a 60W equivalent LED into any socket where you previously had a 60W incandescent and have about the same amount of light for a much lower energy cost.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#55
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't touch a Barracuda with a WD SMR drive duct taped to a 50' pole. The only way to get good hard drives these days is to buy from the enterprise lines e.g. WD Gold or Seagate Exos. They're extremely expensive, but this is the only way to get the kind of quality that used to be standard a few years ago.

Weirdly some Seagate Exos is inexpensive.

Maybe they're only Exos-class.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#56
post #5

I think the TLDR is that Western Digital are selling faster drives marketed as being slower than they actually are, presumably due to lack of supply for the demand of the slower drives part of the market or something like that. You'd think nobody would mind until you remember some people want lower power and noise. Ideally these people would be buying based on those actual metrics, rather than the RPM as a proxy for…

Couldn’t they just software limit the speed? I’m sure they thought of it but it seems on the surface like an easy problem to solve for.

https://old.reddit.com/r/DataHoarder/comments/ikk0rv/psa_mul...

>You cannot just run a drive at a different RPM (except for idling, different RPM while reading/writing requires different read head calibrations and glide height, etc.).

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that based on the amount of lumens it produces

It is, and that's the point: you can screw a 60W equivalent LED into any socket where you previously had a 60W incandescent and have about the same amount of light for a much lower energy cost.

Not everywhere -- LEDs aren't always dimmer switch compatible, and mismatched bulbs on a shared circuit will have weird interactions.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a solid technical reason for that though, as ISPs have no control over the performance of your connection's remote part. Sure, it leaves plenty of room for abuse, but this is a necessary disclaimer, not some slippery marketing.

Does anyone in the US actually get the “up to” even plugging directly into the ISP provided modem at off peak times?

Would be nice if the pricing then corresponded to performance statistics.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is already what they did with "KB/MB/GB/TB." Evil, but not any more blatant.

> This is already what they did with "KB/MB/GB/TB." The 'confusion' as to whether the "K" prefix meant a factor of 10^3 or 2^10 goes back decades. In 1961 a book says "it is more usual to express the speed in bits or kilobits (1,000 bits) per second"; an IBM 1410 manual says ""The 40K core array requires 40,000 valid five-position addresses from 0,000 to 39,999." In 1962 an ACM paper referred to a "4K IBM 1401" which…

In 1962 an ACM paper referred to a "4K IBM 1401" which had 4000 characters of storage, but in 1964 Amdahl wrote a paper that had 1K meaning 1024.

That's easy to explain, as a 1401 is actually a decimal computer.

Re: Western Digital is trying to redefine the word “RPM”

#60
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also includes the fact that their network may be oversubscribed.

There's no "may" about it: they are oversubscribed for consumers so as to get the price points down. If anyone wants to have an unfettered pipe then call up a Tier 1/2/3 ISP and ask for a commercial connection via a single-mode fibre, and be ready to pay quite a bit for it.

> If anyone wants to have an unfettered pipe then call up a Tier 1/2/3 ISP and ask for a commercial connection via a single-mode fibre, and be ready to pay quite a bit for it.

You might be surprised to find it surprisingly affordable. Cheaper than colocation, even.

Post reply on HN