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Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu

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Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#381

Post by Pet_Ant »

Klinky wrote: post #324
marvin wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like an unreasonable statement when meeting a culture that's not your own. Let's say you're offended by the word "blank" because of cultural transgressions that have happened throughout the last 100 years of history in your country. You then emigrate to a different culture that hasn't experienced the context of these transgressions. The word "blank" is in their language used in a purely descriptive sense.…

There is obviously nuance, but if the word sounds like a slur, and is used generally to describe people of a certain race, then the offended can certainly express their offense, and the culture should consider the offended person's position. In this case I am pretty sure the word is "neger", and yeah, I don't think we should mourn or handwring over any sort of great loss of Norweigian culture/heritage that has occurr…

Why should Norway evolve based on American norms or history? This is a form of American cultural colonialism.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#382

Post by svrb »

krapp wrote: post #377
svrb wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> open-mindedness of the left Did you even read the article? How is cancel culture "open-minded"? I'm legitimately confused and shook at how you could come to that conclusion... It would be really helpful if you could explain it.

Why do you believe "the left" is entirely defined by "cancel culture?"

I don't, but I believe "cancel culture" is entirely defined by the left, so again I find the notion of the left being "open-minded" entirely contrary to all lived experience. Can you point to a single piece of evidence for the left being more open-minded?

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#383

Post by stallmanite »

maaaaattttt wrote: post #111

When I read stories like this I can't help but think of Newspeak[0] from 1984. From afar (not a native English speaker nor a US resident here) it feels like a form of control over people through control of their language. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak

As a native English speaker and US citizen / resident I think you are 100% correct in your observation.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#384

Post by huffmsa »

elihu wrote: post #378
ThrowawayR2 wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have said this before and will continue to say this: to put an end to this, liberals in the United States need to openly repudiate identity politics progressivism and cancel culture. Former-President Obama has ( https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/31/us/politics/obama-woke-ca... ); we should too. Please speak up and, more importantly, please vote for old-school liberals instead of progressives.

I'm okay with Obama rejecting identity politics if that's what he's doing, but it seems to me more like he's been spending his time post-presidency advocating for a certain style of incremental reform: just make small fixes right now to make things a little bit better, and as he likes to say: "the arc of history is long, but it bends towards justice". The problem I have with that, is that for some problems you can't…

The Constitution is setup to make sure both sides are radical, but usually at equal enough power that changes they make are agreed upon by both radical factions. Strong ideologies are good. Things go to shit when everyone is a mealy-mouthed, middle of the road moderate, or when one side gets too much power.

Lost that thread somewhat post FDR with the expansion of the executive "rule making" bullshit though.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#385

Post by himinlomax »

anonu wrote: post #251
himinlomax wrote: post #33

I've always found the US obsession with taboo words quite baffling. I used to tease Americans of my acquaintance by pretending to be offended when they said "oh my god" (dildo in French) or nick (fuck.) Context matters a lot in linguistic, and the Sapir-Worff hypothesis is not just unproven, it's almost certainly completely wrong.

"nique" or "niquer" in French is pretty interesting... It's actually an Arabic swear word meaning the same thing.

I doubt « forniquer » is Arabic.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#386

Post by ploopop »

vianneychevalie wrote: post #340
wildrhythms wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you kindly provide an example of the type of behavior you might engage in at work in absence of the 'woke patrol' (as you described it)?

In my personal case it would be using the words « master » and « slave » when talking about interfacing databases

I'm surprised master/slave's the hill you want to die on - it's the one instance where the old terminology really is just bizarre jargon that's being replaced with words that are a direct, common-language description of what they do.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#387

Post by adfm »

danielam wrote: post #375

When I was a child, I was in the supermarket with my mother and apparently I was repeating some Polish phrase containing the infinitive “to be”. The Polish equivalent is “być” which sounds like “bitch”. From what I’ve been told, it drew some attention, but the impression I’m left with is that eavesdroppers were more amused than offended. Similarly, my Spanish-speaking classmates in school found it amusing that a comm…

I just watched the video and in context, suspending this guy does a disservice to: the student, who must learn to listen and process in context; the educator, who must teach without fear; and the school, that loses revenue because it becomes both feared and a laughing stock. If I've somehow been misled, I don't mean to offend, but seriously, this does not bode well for anyone in higher education.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#388

Post by whiddershins »

hitekker wrote: post #338
whiddershins wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would never be accidental. In China, English language students are taught to break that habit for fear of it being misinterpreted by a native English speaker. It could be opportunistically malicious though, to feign outrage. That’s not beyond the realm of possibility at all. Edit: people are asking how I ‘know’ this. —— It is anecdotal, so I should have phrased it more carefully. When I was in mainland China about…

> It would never be accidental. As someone with a number of friends from the mainland, I can assure you it does happen by accident. None of them were taught to avoid saying “na ge” because it is the English equivalent of "that" or "that one". Where are you getting your information from?

It is anecdotal, so I should have phrased it more carefully. When I was in mainland China about 15 years ago I talked to several people eager to practice their English, in various regions.

They were aware. One kid in particular I remember vividly having that conversation.

But this was a very small sample.

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#389

Post by crc32 »

I can’t believe the reactionary comments to this.

Of course, we have no idea of the context. But if it was anything like the linked video - and it could have been worse - it’s perfectly understandable why students would be surprised and perhaps upset.

If you disagree, its worth asking yourself, what reaction would you expect if you were a chinese professor enunciating the word “cunt” during a lecture, with no prior warning?

Re: Professor suspended for saying 那个 nà ge

#390

Post by Rebelgecko »

asddubs wrote: post #353
valuearb wrote: post #339

I once said in a senior staff meeting that we shouldn’t be niggardly with employee benefits. A disturbing quiet dropped over the room and I realized a half dozen white men and women were staring at me, while uncomfortably not making eye contact with our African American Business Development director. The CEO rebuked me saying that was not the type of language I should be using. The Director of Business Development th…

To be honest, when I hear someone use that word, I do assume it's primarily in service of saying something that sounds like the n-word with plausible deniability. It'd be something else if it was a commonly used word

I saw a reddit comment not long ago that said something along the lines of "Intelligence is knowing that the word niggardly has a non-racist etymology. Wisdom is deciding not to say it anyways because it's not worth the hassle" (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_n...)
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