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Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

palladiummag.com

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Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#131

Post by rorykoehler »

wenc wrote: post #93

Wow. This article is one of the most compelling I've read in a while. There's even a bit in there about models and reality with respect to (authoritarian) governance and size, and why simplistic schemata suffer from large errors in larger states: "Decision-makers must rely on simplified models to make their decisions. All schemata are by nature imperfect representations of reality. Indeed, a scheme that reflected rea…

Singapore is even more like a startup than you allude to. The whole country is run like a large corporation.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#132

Post by mattkrause »

bobthepanda wrote: post #98
baybal2 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA, a big one. Much of Europe for the second place? As for Asia, Taiwanese are quite low despite high bar, South Korean, and Japanese were more or less equal to average white collar job. Malaysia can be though of as a mid income country, and their local government salaries lag behind white collar jobs. China... is a special case

I don't think anyone considers the American civil service to be much of a model for anything.

The current administration has certainly done some damage but:

- the NIH is one of the biggest drivers of biomedical research in the world, both in terms of extramural funding and intramural research. The NSF, NASA, and the research arms of the DoD and DoE (etc) are also world-class.

- Hurricane Dorian nonsense aside, the weather and ocean forecasts from NOAA/NWS are well-regarded.

- the FAA and FDA have kept flying, food, and medicine quite safe.

- The National Parks System is fantastic and the USGS maps are quite good; maybe only the UK’s OS maps are better regarded.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#133

Post by BatFastard »

leafboi wrote: post #116
wenc wrote: post #93

Wow. This article is one of the most compelling I've read in a while. There's even a bit in there about models and reality with respect to (authoritarian) governance and size, and why simplistic schemata suffer from large errors in larger states: "Decision-makers must rely on simplified models to make their decisions. All schemata are by nature imperfect representations of reality. Indeed, a scheme that reflected rea…

I think because HN's audience is mostly US based there's a high level of bias towards democratic governments. I think if we all take a look at it from a unbiased angle it's all really apples and oranges. A bad dictator is not so different from a democracy electing bad leaders and a good dictator is not so different from a democracy electing good leaders. The thing with a democracy is that you have a lot of checks and…

Problem with a bad dictator is you may be stuck with him/her for life. With elected leaders you can usually get rid of them.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#134

Post by markdown »

leafboi wrote: post #110
_7fvc wrote: post #107

This article doesn't mention that Lee Kuan Yew was a staunch supporter of the Khmer Rouge. It's a genocidal regime that killed millions of people. Lee remains a strong supporter after he knew about the genocide. He also made efforts to dodge responsibility. He said the US and China were bigger supporters than Singapore. Financially, the US and China contributed more money. But Lee Kuan Yew seems to be the mastermind…

Let's not turn this into a character assassination. That's what they do in politics and I hope HN is above this stuff. Henry Ford invented the modern factory by bringing the conveyor belt into the manufacturing system. He was also an anti-Semite who supported Hitler. Do not ignore the fact he was an anti-semite, but also do not ignore the fact that he invented the modern factory. People are complicated, contradictory…

> Let's not turn this into a character assassination.

This discussion is filled with praise for the late dictator. But say something negative and "let's not turn this into a character assassination". When discussing a notable person, why shouldn't we talk about their flaws as much as their positive attributes?

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#135

Post by jb1991 »

ergocoder wrote: post #100
wenc wrote: post #93

Wow. This article is one of the most compelling I've read in a while. There's even a bit in there about models and reality with respect to (authoritarian) governance and size, and why simplistic schemata suffer from large errors in larger states: "Decision-makers must rely on simplified models to make their decisions. All schemata are by nature imperfect representations of reality. Indeed, a scheme that reflected rea…

Yes. It's one flaw of democracy. In a dictatorship, if the leader is great, it will grow like crazy... It's like a startup with great founders. On the other hand, the problem will come when a hand-off needs to happen. Singapore is clever enough to keep the democratic process, so it has some decent hand-off process.

> Singapore is clever enough to keep the democratic process

Mainly it appears to be a democracy. Speak to any of the cab drivers there who feel somewhat liberated to talk safely with a foreigner who is on the way to the airport, and they will tell you something about Singapore's democracy.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#136

Post by hellofunk »

rorykoehler wrote: post #131
wenc wrote: post #93

Wow. This article is one of the most compelling I've read in a while. There's even a bit in there about models and reality with respect to (authoritarian) governance and size, and why simplistic schemata suffer from large errors in larger states: "Decision-makers must rely on simplified models to make their decisions. All schemata are by nature imperfect representations of reality. Indeed, a scheme that reflected rea…

Singapore is even more like a startup than you allude to. The whole country is run like a large corporation.

Yes, even to the degree that its leaders have become quite wealthy through the infrastructure of the government.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#137

Post by hellofunk »

leafboi wrote: post #116
wenc wrote: post #93

Wow. This article is one of the most compelling I've read in a while. There's even a bit in there about models and reality with respect to (authoritarian) governance and size, and why simplistic schemata suffer from large errors in larger states: "Decision-makers must rely on simplified models to make their decisions. All schemata are by nature imperfect representations of reality. Indeed, a scheme that reflected rea…

I think because HN's audience is mostly US based there's a high level of bias towards democratic governments. I think if we all take a look at it from a unbiased angle it's all really apples and oranges. A bad dictator is not so different from a democracy electing bad leaders and a good dictator is not so different from a democracy electing good leaders. The thing with a democracy is that you have a lot of checks and…

This is somewhat of a naive view -- the risks of any kind of dictatorship far outweigh any slight chance of good.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#138

Post by mobilefriendly »

mattkrause wrote: post #132
bobthepanda wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think anyone considers the American civil service to be much of a model for anything.

The current administration has certainly done some damage but: - the NIH is one of the biggest drivers of biomedical research in the world, both in terms of extramural funding and intramural research. The NSF, NASA, and the research arms of the DoD and DoE (etc) are also world-class. - Hurricane Dorian nonsense aside, the weather and ocean forecasts from NOAA/NWS are well-regarded. - the FAA and FDA have kept flying,…

The FDA blocked private testing at a critical point early in the coronavirus. The FDA keeps many lifesaving treatments out of the US, at a large and unseen cost. For example, the FDA blocked UVB sunscreens for a decade after they were permitted in Europe. Those extra US skin cancer deaths are "unseen" but are casualties of the FDA. In turn, the FAA allowed Boeing to "self-regulate" approvals of the MAX and after the first plane went down, still deemed it to be airworthy.

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#139

Post by f00zz »

vajay wrote: post #123

I'm so tire of the Singapore miracle and Lee Kuan Yew hymn as someone who received education and lived early life there. I do believe on certain grounds they are produced and promoted by public relation department of Singapore government, as a counter-measure to all the criticism concerning human rights, free speech, totalitarianism, etc. To put it shortly, Singapore is just China in minuscule, just that Singaporean…

Please insert some line breaks

Re: Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore

#140

Post by ValentineC »

ShorsHammer wrote: post #77
not_a_moth wrote: post #17

Singapore's population is very conservative, e.g. live with parents until marry, homosexuality is illegal, a lot of pressure against interracial couples (my experience), and essentially a single, dominant media voice. There is a militant approach to education which produces nice test results, but it doesn't produce young entrepreneurs, just conservative careers, helped by statutory hiring quotas. I don't think the Si…

> homosexuality is illegal And yet the gay bars do roaring trade waving their flags outside, no real surprise, they are far more fun than many alternatives.

We should be specific: homosexuality isn't illegal in Singapore.

Sex between men is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_377A_of_the_Penal_Code...

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