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Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

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Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#901

Post by aiyodev »

AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

If you think Apple owners don’t know about this, you are mistaken. Curating the App Store is one of the main reasons why I buy Apple products. I want them to tax and restrict developers.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#902

Post by ocdtrekkie »

Danieru wrote: post #506
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irony here is that PUBG is made with the Unreal Engine, which they're being forced by a judge not to cut off from their platform, and Epic still gets 5% of all revenue from PUBG.

Heads up, PUBG was released under the EULA and thus the 5% but after release the publisher sued to be able to buy a buyout license. Thus no, Epic gets no new revenue from PUBG.

Thanks, good note. I'd argue half of my comment remains valid though: If Apple hadn't gotten a TRO from the judge, PUBG would be unable to get Unreal Engine updates going forwards.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#903

Post by amelius »

vr46 wrote: post #861
AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

The word "tax", when referring to Apple's fees, is a loaded and partial term. The fact that it's clear and understood and factored into the price makes it easy to complain about, but no casual customer to my knowledge has ever seriously asked what proportion of their peppermint tea and scones pays for a café's rent - overheads are overheads and margins are margins. Both companies are invoking consumers and value in t…

This is a bad analogy because there are many cafes and you can even buy tea in a supermarket and make it at home, whereas for apps the market is cornered.

Apple regulates this market, and we have to pay them a tax.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#904

Post by OctopusLupid »

umvi wrote: post #253
scarface74 wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem solved? You made a choice that was best for you using your own free will.

Yes, problem solved, though obviously I am wistful for a scenario where everyone wins.

Others don’t have the same needs you do.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#905

Post by OctopusLupid »

librish wrote: post #349
notfried wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t need apps on my iPhone to do 100% of all things that apps can do. I am fine with some restrictions, so long as there’s enough reliability, consistency, privacy and security. If there are alternate app stores, I am sure others would make their apps exclusive there and demand you download them through these stores: 1. Facebook will want a store that allows them to build an app that has no ad or data collection…

But why could you not just keep using the AppStore and nothing else? Out of the things you've listed the only one who would actually consider leaving the AppStore would be Epic.

Facebook has been pretty vocal about iOS privacy restrictions as well. They don’t need to make their own store on Android; but they very well might on iOS.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#906

Post by the_other »

amelius wrote: post #853
AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

Informing users about the Apple tax would cause an outrage since users already paid for their phones, and own them.

From some. I simply don’t care. To me, Apple are keeping my highly sensitive data (my phone is my bank card, address book, post box, todo list...) secure. I’m really grateful the tools and experience is consistently so good for so long. Whether I’m paying that 30% or the software devs are, I’m not really bothered. I want the high quality to continue. I accept that multiple app stores may improve things... but from what I hear, that’s not the case on Android.

I think we only have this discussion because of Apple’s market cap. Most others are envious. Sure, Apple have a lot of power, but they do a fairly good job of using it responsibly. The interactions with the Chinese government do desire further scrutiny, however.

I’m not a shareholder.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#907

Post by ksec »

AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

I sort of agree and disagree. I will admit upfront I still cant articulate my thoughts very well on the subject matter.

I dont see why collecting 30% from Games is anything off limit. I consider Gaming as Non-Essential. If you dont like the Gaming Platform. Go Elsewhere. Literally every Gaming Platform collects 30% ( if not more ) on Games being sold. That is everything from early days of Nintendo, Sega, and now Playstation and Xbox. So in the case of EPIC, why are they happy with Sony and Microsoft charging them 30% on Playstation and Xbox? Whether they are losing money on the console sales is irrelevant in this context, that is their business model, and that is how the market works and accept. Nintendo is able to compete with a profits on both console and games.

However charging 30% on Apps, on productivity, business tools and when there are only One competing App Platform in the whole world ( of whole of US ) is where the question of Monopoly or Monopsony comes into play.

I dont think there is an easy answer. On one hand, changing 30% of subscription for Education and Fitness App is ridiculous. Apple being the sole buyer and pitching these client / business / partners against each other while benefiting from it is precisely the definition of Monopsony.

On the other hand, I would much rather paid this 30% extortion than having a platform where user can, no matter how difficult it may be, able to side load Apps. I dont want any of my family member doing it. If you really want the ability to side loads, Android it is.

I think Apple should just keep the 30% on Games. 15% of One Time Purchase Apps, 10% on Subscription and call it a day. I think that is a fair deal. Payment Processing, Fraud Protection, Refund and General Admin and Store Operation would have put it close to 5%. Business aren't losing much with the 10% Rent. With the lower commission Apple can better Enforce the Sign up rules. No more "Reader" App Guidelines. You are allowed to give better deals else where like on your Website. But as a consumer I am happy with the extra 10% for the safety of going through Apple.

And some additional info, it is estimated that 80% of App Store Revenue are from Gaming. So dropping the Apps and Subscription to 15% / 10% arrangement isn't going to make their services revenue collapse. Apple are also working hard on their AppleCare+ push, as you can now buy it within the first year of your purchase and Apple Store Genius has had their KPI percentage increased for AppleCare sold. ( Personally I think what is happening in Apple Retail is even worst than the App Store )

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#908

Post by bluntfang »

renaudg wrote: post #858
AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

"if Apple was OK with displaying a 30% Apple tax on checkout" Do you know any store that adds a line showing their margin on the customer receipt ?

>Do you know any store that adds a line showing their margin on the customer receipt ?

Man i would really love this! the luxury goods market would be ruined overnight when everyone realizes that most of the time you're paying for the brand!

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#909

Post by comprev »

paulgb wrote: post #873
renaudg wrote: post #858

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"if Apple was OK with displaying a 30% Apple tax on checkout" Do you know any store that adds a line showing their margin on the customer receipt ?

I've seen gas stations list two prices, one if you pay with cash and one if with credit. It's not quite what you asked for, but it's an example of passing optional margin related to the choice of payment on to the customer. (Incidentally credit card companies, like Apple, really hate it; I think some states have exceptions in their laws to disallow contracting out of it?)

It's common here in the Netherlands for shops to charge extra for MasterCard/Visa card processing, and they advertise this at the till. Maestro is king in this country.

Buying airline tickets online often display the processing fee for using MasterCard/Visa too.

The important part is other options are displayed so I have a choice - iDeal, PayPal, MasterCard, Visa, bank transfer, etc.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#910

Post by AsyncAwait »

aiyodev wrote: post #901
AsyncAwait wrote: post #841

I don't think Epic is doing anything but trying to pocket more for themselves, yet I also think that the comments here overstate how "aware" average people are about Apple's restrictions, tax etc. I don't think most people would consider direct payment to reputable companies like Epic to be a particular security risk. I don't think most realize why they can't subscribe to Spotify from their iPhones, they think it's s…

If you think Apple owners don’t know about this, you are mistaken. Curating the App Store is one of the main reasons why I buy Apple products. I want them to tax and restrict developers.

> If you think Apple owners don’t know about this, you are mistaken. Curating the App Store is one of the main reasons why I buy Apple products.

You're posting on a site called Hacker News so I'd expect you to know, but does you extended family know, without you telling them? Doubt ir, just as I would expect most people to think "Hacker News" has to do something with illegality or perhaps reporting on criminal hackers.

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