Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#191

Post by phatfish » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:16 PM UTC

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #45

oneplane wrote: post #20

Not sure why people are surprised or consider it giant news. > The court recommended that Epic follow the App Store’s guidelines and policies while the case is in progress – the rules they followed over the past ten years until they created the current situation themselves. Epic refused. Well duh, this is a show match court fight of Epic Games not liking the rules and not getting the special treatment they want. No m…

If Epic Games doesn't get it's way will China give Apple the boot? Are we watching a cold war unfold in front of our eyes?

If only it were really that interesting.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#192

Post by chipotle_coyote » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:16 PM UTC

gameswithgo wrote: post #38

oneplane wrote: post #20

Not sure why people are surprised or consider it giant news. > The court recommended that Epic follow the App Store’s guidelines and policies while the case is in progress – the rules they followed over the past ten years until they created the current situation themselves. Epic refused. Well duh, this is a show match court fight of Epic Games not liking the rules and not getting the special treatment they want. No m…

people familiar with Tim Sweeny’s life and ideology know that it is an actual important issues to him that platforms be open. your cynical take is often very true but there are sometimes real human ideals behind things.

Tim Sweeney may be a wonderful man who loves open platforms, apple pie, and kittens, but:

- Android is clearly more open than iOS, but Epic is also suing Google. So is this really about sideloading? From that suit, it sure doesn't sound like it.

- When you do sideload Fortnite on your Android device, from what I understand, you can't actually sideload Fortnite directly. Instead you have sideload... the Epic Games Store!

It seems awfully clear that Epic's real goal here is to force both Apple and Google to let you install the Epic Games Store from the iOS App Store and the Google Play Store. And while I'm not much of a gamer, the stories I recall about Epic's store in the press... well, we'll just say they didn't have a "so ideals! much open!" vibe to them.

I think there's a lot of valid criticisms to be made about both the "app console" model that Apple is steadfastly pushing and the specific ways in which they're running the App Store, but I am skeptical that Epic is the general this particular battle needs.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#193

Post by grumple » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:16 PM UTC

godzillabrennus wrote: post #174

leptoniscool wrote: post #24

Apple is a monopoly. When Microsoft was investigated and fined for anti-trust behaviors, it hasn't engaged in this level of abuse.

Android is another phone platform with a larger market share. This is hardly a monopoly. Don’t buy an ios device if you want apps from vendors who don’t play by apples rules. I hate the 30% fee as a developer and a user. I was an ios jail breaker before the App Store launched. I used jailbreaking after the App Store launched to have a control panel and fast app switching. All that got baked into ios but I wish new in…

Monopoly != anti-trust violator

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#194

Post by grumple » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:18 PM UTC

coliveira wrote: post #49

leptoniscool wrote: post #24

Apple is a monopoly. When Microsoft was investigated and fined for anti-trust behaviors, it hasn't engaged in this level of abuse.

I don't know if you remember the 90s, but at the time MS was the ONLY monopoly in personal computing. Intel was the other big force, but even they had competition on AMD. All other companies had not even a slim of hope of controlling the ecosystem like MS had. Now we have Apple, but you still can buy Google devices and do whatever you want outside their walled garden.

How were they a monopoly if Apple had their own OS? As did many others?

Microsoft got hit for antitrust because of bundled software. What Apple does is far worse imo, not just bundling software, but the control over the store/devices is nuts.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#195

Post by stock_toaster » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:18 PM UTC

icebraining wrote: post #124

gambiting wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weeeeell.....yes, except that Epic has Tencent behind their back, and while Apple is still bigger, Tencent isn't that far behind.

True, but how much is Tencent really willing to dump behind this fight? There's only so much upside for them even if Epic wins.

How much would the CCP be willing to dump behind a fight to make one of the most valuable US company/brands in the world look bad?

I'm betting.. a lot.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#196

Post by cnst » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:18 PM UTC

godzillabrennus wrote: post #174

leptoniscool wrote: post #24

Apple is a monopoly. When Microsoft was investigated and fined for anti-trust behaviors, it hasn't engaged in this level of abuse.

Android is another phone platform with a larger market share. This is hardly a monopoly. Don’t buy an ios device if you want apps from vendors who don’t play by apples rules. I hate the 30% fee as a developer and a user. I was an ios jail breaker before the App Store launched. I used jailbreaking after the App Store launched to have a control panel and fast app switching. All that got baked into ios but I wish new in…

You can install any other store on Android; you can enable installation from any source on Android; you don't even need to jailbreak to get this option on Android.

Not possible on iOS.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#197

Post by jayd16 » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:18 PM UTC

bitxbit wrote: post #111

leptoniscool wrote: post #24

Apple is a monopoly. When Microsoft was investigated and fined for anti-trust behaviors, it hasn't engaged in this level of abuse.

Might be an unpopular opinion but I don’t think they are acting to the level of MSFT in the 90s. What MSFT did would be equivalent to Apple forcing everyone to use its apps and not allow any competing apps. Also recall that Jobs was pretty adamant about allowing third-party apps in the beginning. Now, do I think 30% is ridiculous in 2020? Yes. But it made sense a decade ago when having a half decent working app almos…

Apple does ban apps that replace built in functionality.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#198

Post by scarface74 » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:18 PM UTC

MaximumMadness wrote: post #21

Apple is truly doing themselves a disservice here, if Epic wins this battle Apple will undoubtedly be painted as the bad guy, and other major companies will smell blood in the water when it comes taking down a competitor. Case in point; Tinder, Microsoft, Facebook, Spotify have all openly backed Epic and started to call attention to features that are impacted by this 30% fee. Status quo isn't going to cut it, and it…

Microsoft explicitly did not back Epic over the issue of the 30% cut, just taking away their developer license to use the Unreal engine.

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#199

Post by microtherion » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:19 PM UTC

MaximumMadness wrote: post #21

Apple is truly doing themselves a disservice here, if Epic wins this battle Apple will undoubtedly be painted as the bad guy, and other major companies will smell blood in the water when it comes taking down a competitor. Case in point; Tinder, Microsoft, Facebook, Spotify have all openly backed Epic and started to call attention to features that are impacted by this 30% fee. Status quo isn't going to cut it, and it…

> Tinder, Microsoft, Facebook, Spotify have all openly backed Epic

Oh, it's going to be so much fun when Epic wins and Taylor Swift decides to apply the same legal reasoning to the cut she pays Spotify for her music…

Re: Apple Terminates Epic Games' Developer Account

#200

Post by toast0 » Fri, Aug 28, 2020, 10:19 PM UTC

cocktailpeanuts wrote: post #82

On one hand I really hope this breaks apart Apple and Google's duoploy in mobile, basically acting as the gatekeeper to all users around the world. On the other hand, I don't feel good about the way Epic went about this. Makes it hard to support them because they were the ones who first started the war by deliberately breaking the terms of service. There's gotta be a better way.

Epic has a more clear case if Epic does what they want and Apple takes action against it than if Epic doesn't do what they want because they fear Apple will takr action against it. Now, the actions have taken place, there's no hypotheticals that courts dislike addressing.