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Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

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Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#291

I'm glad I degoogled. This kind of thing is why. It wasn't even hard after I got email switched over. If they didn't have a video monopoly, I would never have to use their stuff.

The only thing still tying me to google is Gmail. I'm a bit timid about running my own mail servers.

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#292
This will suffer from a backfire effect where the result is you just get more technically savvy radicals. Google's decision here exacerbates polarization. However, I actually welcome it because I would totally join a fediverse with a higher bar to entry, and where ideas had a longer period and participants were committed to building alternatives. It's the real punk. Everyone else can entertain and outrage themselves to death on public platforms where they compete for the reflected approval of a hive mind.

I realize the sort of people who make decisions like this think they are doing this to "win," as the only thing on anyone's mind right now is influencing November, and making sure it "never happens again," but Googlers and tech people like this are creating a self-isolating minority of themselves.

Exiting what has become the Karen-net is probably one of the most interesting problems to solve right now.

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The danger here is viewpoint based discrimination . It should be illegal for a big platform to shut down certain points of view when these points of view are legal and expressed in a normal manner. You can shut down spam without harming the principle of free expression because you can express any idea in a way that isn't spam. The law gives you a legitimate and stable line that you can draw between allowed and disall…

Why should e.g. hate speech be allowed but not spam? Spam is perfectly legal. You’re not actually against lines being drawn through legal speech — you just don’t like where they fall.

Spam is made illegal in America via the CAN-SPAM act.

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit recently dramatically revised their moderation policy and has generally been banning a lot of subs. Reddit very much wants to be a profitable business, and has no problem elimiting non-profitable subreddits. "When your content is too cancerous for church, maybe the issue isn't the church". Feel free to replace church with whatever is appropriate to your situation, but there have always been censors and there w…

This site listes Parler and Voat which have rampant, unchecked antisemitism and racism. I would love to see a non-censorious site that takes hate speech seriously but they don't seem to exist for some reason...

The thing is, any service that offers a "censorship-free" alternative will instantly attract mostly by those whose content is garbage for everyone else: usually it's pedophiles until the operators get a couple not-so-nice letters or a police raid and then at least introduce modest moderation, and then come Nazis, antisemites and conspiracy myth peddlers.

And said hate peddlers then complain that they don't have the reach they enjoyed on Twitter, Youtube and Facebook... well d'oh. Turns out one who is not a Nazi, a journalist reporting about them, or an antifa activist collecting information wants to spend their free time on a platform dominated by Nazis.

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#295

I think the problem is, that two things are getting mixed up. First, there are content providers like Facebook or Youtube. Those platforms store the content of their users and if the content can be publicized the content providers have to apply their rules. Second, there are software providers like the Play Store in its original function, Apples App Store or Amazons App Store. Those platforms should not care about co…

"Content provider" usually refers to people making that content (e.g. individual users of YouTube or Facebook). Maybe "platform" or "service provider" is more appropriate?

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To be fully accurate, this is absolutely censorship, but it's not a violation of anyone's First Amendment rights. People often conflate the two. It's not censorship, its moderation and editorial discretion.

Great. Google should become liable for all the illegal content that slips through, all the way to the officers and directors of the company. I think we as the society agree that child porn and child sexual abuse is a criminally punishable offense. A platform in a possession of it clearly is in a possession and distribution of child pornography, hence officers and directors should be charged under those statues.

Isn't that why we have safe harbor laws to encourage platforms to self regulate and collaborate with law enforcement in exchange for not being sued for those violations ?

Without those provisions no website could allow user created content, as they would instantly be sued to oblivion.

(Standard disclaimer of working for Google)

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#297
post #91

For anyone else concerned with the recent Big Tech censorship, people are actively building alternative social medial platforms and they are taking off. The RedditAlternatives subreddit [0] provides a fairly good overview of them. Some are rather extreme, others are more reasonable, but there are alternatives, and it's up to us, the reasonable people, to choose where we want to spend our time and money. [0] https://w…

When your content is too cancerous for Reddit ...maybe the issue isn't Reddit.

Well, I can tell you what's bugging me personally about this. There's a growing divide in our society between the "equal opportunity" and "equal outcome" camps. And while the "equal opportunity" people mostly have the "just let me grill" attitude, "equal outcomers" are pushing increasingly harder, while doing their best to silence any opposing voices. It's now getting to a point where raising one's kids to be proud of their achievements, seek self-improvement, and pick friends based on shared values, is considered sinful and is being pushed back against.

As a person who was born in a country that tried implementing equal outcomes for 70 years, and ended up with extreme corruption, poverty and social distrust, I don't want to see another round of this happen here. So I am hoping that if enough reasonable people acknowledge the problem, the society will reach some sort of a compromise before the lives of several generations are completely wasted, like they were in the USSR. And having platforms where this sort of discussion is not considered "cancerous" is a very important step IMHO.

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#299
post #95

It always starts like that. People agree to very sensible things. Like hate speech is bad and it’s not censorship if it’s not mandated by the government. Eventually the definition of hate or whatever it is that’s offensive is very removed from the original meaning, and now we all bear the brunt of the sensible people who with best intentions wanted to make things better.

> People agree to very sensible things. Like hate speech is bad and it’s not censorship if it’s not mandated by the government. This doesn’t seem very sensible to me, I would even say it seems to be the opposite of sensible, probably because I am not American.

hate speech is a crime in many european countries too[0].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech_laws_by_country

Re: Google is apparently taking down all/most Fediverse apps from the Play Store

#300

There's racist stuff all over Google's biggest properties. Racist results on Google, videos on youtube, sites hosted on GCP. Give me a break with your fake trashy virtue signalling Google. This is nothing more than a monopoly stomping out a platform it doesn't like. Probably because federation is a threat to Google's position as the central hub of the internet.

Indeed. The real story is federated applications undermine their search monopoly.

Seems the opposite to me: most of the Fediverse is web accessible, where Google Search can crawl it. Google's nemesis are closed platforms owned by other companies (like Facebook).
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