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Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

wondersofphysics.com

91–100 of 110 posts

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Empedocles (c. 490–430 BC) was the first to propose a theory of light, and claimed that light has a finite speed. In 1021, Alhazen (Ibn al-Haytham) published his Book of Optics, in which he presented a series of arguments dismissing Empedocles emission theory of vision in favour of the now accepted intromission theory, in which light moves from an object into the eye. This led Alhazen to propose that light must have…

>the modern origin of Relativity is rooted in Poincaré's work, And Poincare never developed it from first principles, elevating the speed of light being fixed in all frames. Poincare only noted that this was a solution to Lorentz invariance. Einstein did take this as a first principle, and demonstrated what follows: time dilation (something completely alien to all before him, including Galileo). He then derived E=mc^…

time dialation (something completely alien to all before him

No, not so much.

You missed this in my GP comment: "Hendrik Lorentz proposed that the motion of the apparatus through the aether may cause the apparatus to contract along its length in the direction of motion, and he further assumed, that the time variable for moving systems must also be changed accordingly ("local time"), which led to the formulation of the Lorentz transformation."

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#92
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is well-known that Einstein was notoriously bad at mathematics. The sole reason for the decade of delay between his 1905 Special Theory of Relativity and his 1915 General Theory of Relativity is that Einstein did not have the mathematics to calculate the formulas. He needed some of the work done by Hermann Minkowski. By 1908 Minkowski realized that the special theory of relativity, introduced by his former student…

I heard Kip Thorne say, "Einstein was a mediocre mathematician. Now don't get me wrong; he was a vastly better mathematician than I'll ever be, but Hilbert was a great mathematician." We undergrads are sitting around thinking "great: Hilbert > Einsten > Thorne >>>> us. We're doomed"

Fair enough, though I was comparing him to his peers and friends.

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I think his work on the Photo-Electric Effect deserved the recognition that it received. But Albert Einstein is far more myth than man. Everyone idolizes Einstein, he was the quintessential mad scientist. And it is difficult to challenge the notion of this myth without being accused of anti-semetism. But I risk doing so... When one actually studies the History of Science, one discovers shocking things. No…

Empedocles (c. 490–430 BC) was the first to propose a theory of light, and claimed that light has a finite speed. In 1021, Alhazen (Ibn al-Haytham) published his Book of Optics, in which he presented a series of arguments dismissing Empedocles emission theory of vision in favour of the now accepted intromission theory, in which light moves from an object into the eye. This led Alhazen to propose that light must have…

Fabulous! I love this rundown. Is there a source or citation for this writing? Or is it an original synthesis?

If I only got one cite, id be interested in the empedocles...

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#94
post #28

Tesla is one of the most overrated persons in history. Edison is better in every regard, except for killing an elephant

Have you read 1893 "THE INVENTIONS, RESEARCHES AND WRITINGS OF NIKOLA TESLA" by Martin?

It's fantastic and a dollar on kindle. Within 30 years of Maxwell's equations.

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the modern origin of Relativity is rooted in Poincaré's work, And Poincare never developed it from first principles, elevating the speed of light being fixed in all frames. Poincare only noted that this was a solution to Lorentz invariance. Einstein did take this as a first principle, and demonstrated what follows: time dilation (something completely alien to all before him, including Galileo). He then derived E=mc^…

time dialation (something completely alien to all before him No, not so much. You missed this in my GP comment: "Hendrik Lorentz proposed that the motion of the apparatus through the aether may cause the apparatus to contract along its length in the direction of motion, and he further assumed, that the time variable for moving systems must also be changed accordingly ("local time"), which led to the formulation of th…

>>time dialation (something completely alien to all before him

>Hendrik Lorentz prop

Lorentz did not think that time actually dilated; his notion of "local time" he considered purely a mathematical trick, unrelated to actual physics, in the same manner that renormalization sweeps away infinities in a clever manner.

Here's the quote: "While for Lorentz length contraction was a real physical effect, he considered the time transformation only as a heuristic working hypothesis and a mathematical stipulation to simplify the calculation from the resting to a "fictitious" moving system. " [1]

So no, Lorentz absolutely did not think physical time actually dilated. Stop repeating this nonsense.

Also, Lorentz was not the first to publish the time dilation formula. And, like Lorentz, all before him thought it a neat mathematical trick, devoid of actual physics.

Poincare did think it may be actual time dilation, but he too lacked the insights that Einstein had that put these dilation and stretching concepts not as ad-hoc after effects, but that they come from a simple, single physical principle. What's more, Einstein's way of looking at it all was the one that turned out to match reality the best.

For example, in 1905 Poincare introduced "Poincare stresses", another fictitious set of forces, to reconcile the math they didn't like from what they thought of as reality.

Lorentz and Poincare used the now-disproven aether as the basis for their theories. Einstein did not.

Spend a moment reading that wiki page, replete with sources, and especially the section on "The shift to relativity." It's abundantly clear that Einstein was the first to publish the correct interpretation, devoid of all the ad hoc (and physically incorrect) assumptions that Lorentz, Poincare, and others, used to reconcile their belief with the evidence. Einstein, in one simple argument, showed that one simple physical idea - light has the same speed regardless of observer - leads to the correct equations that model reality, needs no other ad hoc forces or aether or any other items.

Here's [2] notes from a talk I gave (and still give from time to time) on a simple derivation of all these things from the one principle.

You spend an incredible amount of time misrepresenting and discounting the work of Einstein, so much so that you're posting many, many wrong items. I gave up listing them since the sheer amount of it baffling. Why?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorentz_ether_theory

[2] https://lomont.org/papers/2011/SpaceTimeTalk.pdf

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Empedocles (c. 490–430 BC) was the first to propose a theory of light, and claimed that light has a finite speed. In 1021, Alhazen (Ibn al-Haytham) published his Book of Optics, in which he presented a series of arguments dismissing Empedocles emission theory of vision in favour of the now accepted intromission theory, in which light moves from an object into the eye. This led Alhazen to propose that light must have…

Fabulous! I love this rundown. Is there a source or citation for this writing? Or is it an original synthesis? If I only got one cite, id be interested in the empedocles...

Shamefully, everything is from Wikipedia, so the citations are there.

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

time dialation (something completely alien to all before him No, not so much. You missed this in my GP comment: "Hendrik Lorentz proposed that the motion of the apparatus through the aether may cause the apparatus to contract along its length in the direction of motion, and he further assumed, that the time variable for moving systems must also be changed accordingly ("local time"), which led to the formulation of th…

>>time dialation (something completely alien to all before him >Hendrik Lorentz prop Lorentz did not think that time actually dilated; his notion of "local time" he considered purely a mathematical trick, unrelated to actual physics, in the same manner that renormalization sweeps away infinities in a clever manner. Here's the quote: "While for Lorentz length contraction was a real physical effect, he considered the t…

It is in the ballpark. The point is that Einstein did not pull a rabbit out of his hat, others had thought similar weirdness, and Einstein was aware of it.

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

time dialation (something completely alien to all before him No, not so much. You missed this in my GP comment: "Hendrik Lorentz proposed that the motion of the apparatus through the aether may cause the apparatus to contract along its length in the direction of motion, and he further assumed, that the time variable for moving systems must also be changed accordingly ("local time"), which led to the formulation of th…

>>time dialation (something completely alien to all before him >Hendrik Lorentz prop Lorentz did not think that time actually dilated; his notion of "local time" he considered purely a mathematical trick, unrelated to actual physics, in the same manner that renormalization sweeps away infinities in a clever manner. Here's the quote: "While for Lorentz length contraction was a real physical effect, he considered the t…

I'd also like to point out that Einstein was humble, and the myth of Einstein that developed was not his doing. It was the common man, the everyday people and the press of the time that said, incorrectly, "wow! He is so smart, no one can understand what he is doing!" Which is patently false. Non-physicists could not be expected to understand Relativity. But the physicist peers of Einstein didn't have much trouble with it, contrary to Arthur Eddington's famous quote in response to the statement that only 3 people in the world understood Einstein, "I am trying to think who the third would be." False. Physicists of the day that looked at his work understood his work.

To Einstein's credit, one of the hallmarks of his genius, he had an ability to take complex ideas and describe them very simply, so that any might understand.

It is General Relativity that is Einstein's really only major contribution worth noting. And that is enough! Though he was first to describe Special Relativity, had he not, someone else would have within a few years of his publication. But had Einstein not given us General Relativity, it might have taken another 50 or 75 years for that to appear. But it also absolutely would have come from someone else had Einstein never existed.

Einstein is amazing, he is just not at all the myth that everyone thinks he was. He was just a humble theoretical physicist.

Re: Scientists who never won a Nobel Prize

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>time dialation (something completely alien to all before him >Hendrik Lorentz prop Lorentz did not think that time actually dilated; his notion of "local time" he considered purely a mathematical trick, unrelated to actual physics, in the same manner that renormalization sweeps away infinities in a clever manner. Here's the quote: "While for Lorentz length contraction was a real physical effect, he considered the t…

I'd also like to point out that Einstein was humble, and the myth of Einstein that developed was not his doing. It was the common man, the everyday people and the press of the time that said, incorrectly, "wow! He is so smart, no one can understand what he is doing!" Which is patently false. Non-physicists could not be expected to understand Relativity. But the physicist peers of Einstein didn't have much trouble wit…

>It is General Relativity that is Einstein's really only major contribution worth noting.

Special relativity was a leap no one else was making, despite 20+ years of people knowing enough to make the leap. He also postulated light was made of photons (which was correct) to explain the photoelectric effect, which is another amazingly important thing. That one a Nobel Prize, but according to you, this is not a major contribution?

He developed the quantum theory of heat, also correct.

He gave solid empirical evidence for atomic theory using statistical physics.

He showed energy and mass are interchangeable (E=mc^2).

He predicted gravitational waves, just recently demonstrated, giving Thorne and other a Nobel. Had this demonstration been during Einstein's life, he would have gotten another Nobel prize.

He discovered the field equations predicted a dynamic, changing universe, something so far from thought at the time he tried to fight it by adding a cosmological constant, but he published the dynamic possibility anyways.

He (with Rosen) created a model of wormholes in 1935.

He invented Bose-Einstein condensates (Bose published statistics on photons, Einstein modified that to apply more widely and demosnteated completely new states of matter).

I could go on and on.

It's baffling you consider all this, especially one Nobel prize and enough for a second, to not be major contributions to physics.

>had Einstein not given us General Relativity, it might have taken another 50 or 75 years for that to appear

Also not true. As you yourself pointed out, Hilbert was right there, and if Einstein had not published, it would not have been more than a year until Hilbert (or a host of others) would have made the same discovery.

This "50 or 75 year" claim is just pulled from nowhere, like a lot of your other claims.

Rereading your posts on this, you clearly have selected at every possible point an anti-Einstein view, far more than is reasonable from the evidence. I could go on to post a ton more sourced items you get wrong.

Oh well, hopefully anyone reading this deep doesn't just believe the things you wrote, but takes some time to check them. I've provided enough places for them to start.

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