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Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

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Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#381

Post by rglullis »

Silhouette wrote: post #321
rglullis wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it really matter? If not one brand, you get screwed by another. What we need is a push for free software in consumer electronics. Get any major manufacturer to realize that they can not differentiate on software and stick to making good hardware. The sooner they accept that Google is eating their lunch on the value-add anyway and that the best way to counter them is by commoditizing the software stack. Were I an…

With TVs specifically, this could be a tough sell for manufacturers, because of all the hardware-enabled rights protection that is needed to watch content in certain formats now. There will be some level of exclusive access/control involved as long as those schemes are operating, and that gives them power.

Sorry, I am failing to understand you. "Gives them power", who?

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#382

Post by perpetualpatzer »

swiley wrote: post #350
Silhouette wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The modern problem of having your data locked up is a much bigger one than the old arguments about Free Software. Data portability would be a good solution to a lot of the problems with user-hostile technologies. The trouble is, given the vast range of things we do with technology, it may be unreasonable or impractical to create a universal obligation for software developers to provide export facilities that allow tr…

Is it so hard to just give the user a sql dump of all of their data? (or a json blob if it’s some nosql thing.) If it’s not in a db then just give them the files. None of that seems complicated.

I'd imagine it could be hard if a company folds. No money to pay to keep servers running. No money to pay employees who know SQL to keep working.

Possibly, you could mandate that all software include a working self service data retrieval feature and fine the trust if they shut it off before a certain point in bankruptcy, but that seems heavy- handed and still won't work if there's no money in the accounts.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#383

Post by Legogris »

imhoguy wrote: post #356
Legogris wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My gripe here is with system updates, not apps from the Play Store.

But system is composed of system apps which are APKs too e.g. launchers, camera apps, even settings. You can install alternatives freely. Although it is not easy to side-load older stock version without root.

Fun fact: Samsung Galaxy devices have a physical e-fuse that will trip if you root it, thereby voiding any warranty. If there's any way around that, I'm all ears though!

My next phone purchase obviously won't be from Samsung. And that concludes my venting about it in this thread.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#384

Post by whatisthiseven »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #370
Silhouette wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a much bigger issue than just TVs. And you seem to have ignored my entire final paragraph, which was about what I think we need to do to improve the situation. I am doing my part; I contact my representatives to draw tech issues to their attention, for example, and I donate to various relevant campaign groups. But I am only one person, and it will take more than just me and a few people like me to effect chan…

> This is a much bigger issue than just TVs. You start somewhere > And you seem to have ignored my entire final paragraph which culminated in >> sadly, it seems a lot of people either don't care enough to do that instead of moaning on Twitter of Facebook and then accepting their fate. which is you accepting your fate, it seems. You suggested nothing useful, only moaned that others couldn't be bothered. In summary you…

How do you get results, and what kind of results have you got from bugging manufacturers? Genuinely curious.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#386

Post by neonihil »

I went as far a building my own router out of an ARM box and denying all traffic going to known update servers. I’m now adding auto-detection of update-looking DNS lookups and denying those too.

Ironically, I’m keeping the router’s software up to date though. Security is important. But it’s linux, I can always roll back.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#387

Post by TheRealDunkirk »

gruturo wrote: post #328
narrowtux wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not holding my breath about the TV use-case of 5G. The ISPs will just make it too expensive to allow you to watch as much TV as you like.

The embedded 5G won't be for movies, but for ads, telemetry and forced updates.

Well, it looks like enough of us either can't figure out how to attach the TV to the internet, or just don't bother (like me) to the point that -- like with ad blockers -- TV manufacturers are routing around the problem. That they would subsidize a 5G cell connection in order to get direct access to your TV should be seriously concerning. But it won't be, and cries to Congress to block this sort of thing will be met with a big infusion of campaign contributions, and we'll just all have to live with it.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#388

Post by wolco »

burntoutfire wrote: post #308
unionpivo wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been in IT for over 20 years now. I have had orders of magnitude more problem with updates than with malware/viruses/hackers. The thing is with malware/viruses/hackers sooner or later something will get through any defences, so you need robust recovery system anyway. And most updates that brake systems are not even security updates. I wouldn't mind automated security updates, but many many many maybe most vend…

> I have had orders of magnitude more problem with updates than with malware/viruses/hackers. Maybe that's precisely because the updates are preventing you from being owned?

The % of security fixes vs speed ui improvements is 100 to 1. Very rarely do we get issues that require forced updates that a once a year limit on these types of updates would be ideal.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#389

Post by pbhjpbhj »

AznHisoka wrote: post #371
jiggawatts wrote: post #252

Don't forget: "Never slow down the user interface". I have a 4K Sony television that was their flagship model when it was new, but a couple of years ago they "updated" it with a new version of its OS that looks identical but is incredibly sluggish. Not technically broken, but frustrating to use. Moving around between menu items is a good 2-3 seconds, up to 10 in some cases. There is literally nothing I can do about t…

Just buy a Roku TV. Those things are the cheapest in the market but their Easy to use UI beats everyone else.

Well Roku/NowTv did the same to me - "upgraded" my box to remove functionality, namely side-loading an app, which was the only reason I bought it. We were paying for a monthly subscription and I used the box for viewing photos from my PC and format-shifted movies (which was lawful in UK at the time AFAIAA; but isn't now).

I'm not buying hardware from them if they countenance unlawfully (contravenes UK Computer Misuse Act) accessing my device and removing functionality.

Buyer beware.

Anyway, we switched to FireTv - the same app I was side-loading was in the app store, tried Netflix, it's good enough.

Honestly I don't know how much Roku were involved in the process of crippling my STB, but there are other companies so I'm just going to avoid them.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#390

Post by wolco »

enriquto wrote: post #260
cs702 wrote: post #8

As a user of software, I couldn't agree more with the OP that automatic updates: > should always keep the user centric > should be incremental and security or bug fixes only > should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default > should never be used to install telemetry or spyware or to re-enable it if it was previously switched off > should never be used to install other…

> when updating software on my computer without my permission. This never happens. No software is ever run on your computer without your permission unless you install it (or willingly buy the computer with that software pre-installed). If you install software that auto-updates, you have it coming.

If you make your own chipsets and processor.
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