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Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

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Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#81

Post by viraptor »

anchpop wrote: post #60
viraptor wrote: post #54

I like the main idea here, but the points listed are a bit extreme. Specifically this one: > should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default Are you ready to pay for the ongoing support of all legacy interfaces, including the ones you're not using and which are possibly not used by anyone in the world (no telemetry)? Are you ready for all the bugs and security issues t…

I think they mean that you only have to support the most interface besides the new one, not every single version

Then if you get 4 updates in a row that are: UI, security, UI, security, you have to choose which one you care about more.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#82

Post by bobbylarrybobby »

anchpop wrote: post #60
viraptor wrote: post #54

I like the main idea here, but the points listed are a bit extreme. Specifically this one: > should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default Are you ready to pay for the ongoing support of all legacy interfaces, including the ones you're not using and which are possibly not used by anyone in the world (no telemetry)? Are you ready for all the bugs and security issues t…

I think they mean that you only have to support the most interface besides the new one, not every single version

Well then for people using the previous version of the interface, updates still force them onto a different interface.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#83

Post by [deleted] »

wvenable wrote: post #4

Some automatic updates should really just be different products. The most obvious one at the moment is Android Firefox is getting a big automatic update that, for a lot of people, will be a very big downgrade and an unfriendly UI change. But Mozilla doesn't want to maintain security patches for X different products. And that's true of most vendors. This model of computing where all users are always on the latest vers…

[deleted]

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#85

Post by bilegeek »

gruez wrote: post #75
bilegeek wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read[1] that it's possible to legally obtain LTSC without volume licensing by purchasing a few other Microsoft thingies. Is such a method how you did this, or did you unfurl your sails? Btw (rant incoming), this isn't a spiel against piracy. If Microsoft complains that people pirate LTSC without providing an easy legal way to obtain it, they can cry me a river. I just switched over to Linux from Win7 early this…

>Is such a method how you did this, or did you unfurl your sails? Neither. Ended up using a msdn key.

If it's safe to say so - I don't wanna jeopardize your methods here - how did you obtain it? As far as I can tell, normal consumers can't buy them "legit", but they are "illegitimately" resold anyways, which makes rejection of their "validity" during activation a possibility (assuming Microsoft finds out, of course).

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#86

Post by spaetzleesser »

tomc1985 wrote: post #65
cs702 wrote: post #8

As a user of software, I couldn't agree more with the OP that automatic updates: > should always keep the user centric > should be incremental and security or bug fixes only > should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default > should never be used to install telemetry or spyware or to re-enable it if it was previously switched off > should never be used to install other…

That will never happen as long as shareholders are the only people that companies are legally beholden to That will never happen as long as software continues to be regarded as a "cost center" That will never happen as long as developers insist that their happiness is more immportant than that of their users That will never happen as long as evangelists keep pushing this doctrine that more updates, more features, mor…

"shareholders are the only people that companies are legally beholden to"

I don't think that's actual true. As far as I know the only legal obligation a company has is to conduct lawful business.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#87

Post by pessimizer »

zmj wrote: post #68
cs702 wrote: post #8

As a user of software, I couldn't agree more with the OP that automatic updates: > should always keep the user centric > should be incremental and security or bug fixes only > should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default > should never be used to install telemetry or spyware or to re-enable it if it was previously switched off > should never be used to install other…

> For them, it's often cheaper or more profitable in the short run not to do any of these things. For free-as-in-beer software? You get what you pay for. Supporting a full matrix of (security release) * (feature release) combinations isn't cheap.

> Supporting a full matrix of (security release) * (feature release) combinations isn't cheap.

Having paid for something isn't a magical spell that wards this away. Having sunk costs makes it less likely that the users will migrate away after unpleasant, user-hostile changes, not more. Having a budget also allows for enough PR to bury the complaints.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#88

Post by spaetzleesser »

chrisseaton wrote: post #7

> should never update a user interface without allowing the previous one to be used as the default I don’t understand why people are so precious about their UI and workflow. They obviously managed to learn and adapt to the current UI. Why can’t they adapt to a new one? If you’re super sensitive to something as trivial as a change to a menu location maybe that’s a sign you should be automating whatever your workflow i…

"I don’t understand why people are so precious about their UI and workflow. They obviously managed to learn and adapt to the current UI. Why can’t they adapt to a new one?"

Why constantly adapt to a new UI that does the same thing in a different way? That causes a lot of mental churn without any benefit.

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#89

Post by spaetzleesser »

chrisseaton wrote: post #21
taneq wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somebody sneak into this guy's office and move his 'debug run' key from F5 to F9.

I don’t use keyboard shortcuts TBH.

How about moving your mouse from left to right every week? Or switch keyboard layout?

Re: Why Johnny Won't Upgrade

#90

Post by cortesoft »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #39

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and has the right to share it. Even in the case it may be unpopular amongst certain groups. As an end user, I do not like automatic updates (which may or may not be "upgrades"). I try to avoid software that relies on this approach wherever I can. I consciously choose software that is not in constant flux, unless something is broken. There is not a single software author that I trust…

> I prefer to evaluate software before I install it.

How do you do this?

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