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Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

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71–80 of 639 posts

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#71
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we don’t want control over our Nintendo switch or iPhone.

You don't want the full capabilities of your hardware you paid for? The Nvidia Jetson is the controllable version of the switch and it's much weaker. You don't want your switch to play games and be a hardware accelerator? You don't want the best silicon to run your own software?

No I don’t want any of that. I want the iPhone as-is.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#72
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we don’t want control over our Nintendo switch or iPhone.

But why? What is the benefit of giving up that control?

Delegating that control is, in effect, a form of collective bargaining. Whereas Epic could convince individual users to accept whatever terms of use they wanted to impose, effectively Apple collectively bargains for all those users. That means that, if you like the way Apple negotiates and are comfortable with the trade offs they make, you have much more leverage than if you were negotiating as an individual.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#73

I still wonder why so many people buy devices, where the only software you could run has to be approved by the manufacturer. I think we should speak more about this fact, so that people think twice before they buy some device. I only make websites, but I am worried, that at some point, Apple would want me to pay them, so that my website is openable on their devices.

Because it does not matter to the vast majority of people. In fact many appreciate that there is a gate keeper. There are so many categories where you cannot load software outside of what the manufacturer provides that you cannot list them. It would also be impractical to allow otherwise for many of these. Then you end up with warranty issues. Would you allow people to load software of their choice for their automobi…

> Would you allow people to load software of their choice for their automobiles?

Obviously yes.

> Smart TVs usually are limited by their OS and encumbered by licensing that locks down what can be loaded. This mostly is because of decoding legalities

It's because of DRM. Nothing here benefits the customer.

> Who becomes liable if your privacy, assets, or even the device, are compromised because you were able to load software not vetted?

You, the owner, of course.

> Do you want a world where you need a virus scan program for your phone?

Like on Android?

> I look at it this way, you have a choice in what you buy

You don't. That's the whole point of walled gardens, taking that choice away from you.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#74
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is having control over what you can install on your own PC and being in a position to actually choose from where to install it a nightmare? Is being in control and having choice a nightmare?

Its a security nightmare.

Security isn't that important.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#75

I still wonder why so many people buy devices, where the only software you could run has to be approved by the manufacturer. I think we should speak more about this fact, so that people think twice before they buy some device. I only make websites, but I am worried, that at some point, Apple would want me to pay them, so that my website is openable on their devices.

Because it does not matter to the vast majority of people. In fact many appreciate that there is a gate keeper. There are so many categories where you cannot load software outside of what the manufacturer provides that you cannot list them. It would also be impractical to allow otherwise for many of these. Then you end up with warranty issues. Would you allow people to load software of their choice for their automobi…

I am thankful every time I drive that I'm able to run software of my choice in my automobile. Mazda never seemed to get around to adding Android Auto to my 2015, and yet I use it whenever I feel like, and I didn't have to pay a dealer $300 to install software!

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#76
post #56

I still wonder why so many people buy devices, where the only software you could run has to be approved by the manufacturer. I think we should speak more about this fact, so that people think twice before they buy some device. I only make websites, but I am worried, that at some point, Apple would want me to pay them, so that my website is openable on their devices.

there is no equivalent alternative. Android is laggy, low-quality, malware-infested junk. Windows Phone was beginning to look good. It has great design, quick OS and apps. I wish Microsoft continued at low cost operative mode and just waited for the right opportunities like this.

When was the last time you used Android? That sounds true of 2012 or so but not after.

Android does have a poor status though, the value of it's phones drops precipitously every few months until it levels at $100-$200 a year later, or it was cheap in the first place and good like xiaomi. iPhones don't drop like that.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#77

Can anyone explain exactly how Apple "blocks" Unreal Engine? I was under the impression that it's a 3rd-party library, available directly from Epic, that anybody is free to link their game to. So I'm struggling to understand the mechanism by which Apple blocks it. Any clarity on this would be appreciated.

Epic needs access to Apple's developer tools and documentation to continue developing the Unreal Engine software and libraries for macOS and iOS. Without access to those things, it would be difficult for Epic to produce new versions of the Unreal Engine, and game developers wouldn't want to use it any more.

Yes but any developer can have his or her own account that gives access to every tool, only for pushing software to the store it's vital to have that one particular account for Epic. Epic will lose perks like direct access to performance tuning teams at Apple, but that's not something you can't do without.

So "difficult" would mean that you need to improvise a bit, but they're still able to develop just like any developer. If you want to put your own cocoapod out, you don't need a developer license to do so and if someone else wants to use your cocoapod they just need their own developer account.

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#78
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't want the full capabilities of your hardware you paid for? The Nvidia Jetson is the controllable version of the switch and it's much weaker. You don't want your switch to play games and be a hardware accelerator? You don't want the best silicon to run your own software?

No I don’t want any of that. I want the iPhone as-is.

You understand why others find it strange you don't and why they do though, right?

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#79
post #50
post #19

Epic is just the new gang in town establishing themselves while trying to get some shops under their control, by playing being against the long time block owners.

This. Actions speak louder than words and Epic's anti-Linux actions with their store are extremely telling that their rhetoric about supporting open platforms is purely self-serving.

[deleted]

Re: Apple ordered to not block Epic’s Unreal Engine, Fortnite to stay off App Store

#80
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you just look at the PC ecosystem and you can see the nightmare. Like others,I prefer Apple to have a tightly controlled App Store and believe that the benefits far outweigh the ability to install software from a 3rd party App Store. For example, Apple requiring Sign In with Apple (when signin with Google/Facebook are implemented) where you can hide your email address. That’s not possible with multiple app stor…

I do not see a nightmare, that is the thing - why do you see one? What you describe is possible with multiple app stores and allowing 3rd party apps - you just do not use those other stores and apps. Nobody is forcing you to use a 3rd party app store, but Apple is forcing everyone to go through their store. You can keep your tightly controlled experience by not using anything else than Apple - but that doesn't mean e…

Nobody is forcing you to use an iPhone either. There are plenty of options with different trade offs.

Allowing 3rd-party app stores has predictable negative externalities (privacy, security, etc.). Which is why I and others are not interested in that development. Apple is able to make developers engage in less shitty business practices precisely because they can control the distribution of software through the App Store . It’s no surprise that as Apple has increasingly focused on privacy and removing tracking capabilities and other dark patterns that developers are trying to find a way around Apple’s restrictions. It’s not like they all of a sudden implemented a new fee. It’s been there for years.

> 99.9%....

I guess this is the .1%? You don’t buy something expecting it to do something completely different. You don’t buy an iPhone expecting to install whatever you want. You don’t buy a Corolla expecting to off-road with it.

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