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Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

latimes.com

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Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#71

Post by BelleOfTheBall »

mbowcutt wrote: post #53
rectang wrote: post #44

Should the revolution fail, the digital trail left by these messages will give the government everything they need to hunt down every last activist. We saw it with the Green Revolution in Iran. We've seen it several times since. So long as messages are not encrypted, messaging apps are much more naturally suited as tools of oppression than tools of revolution.

I don't know too much about Telegram but isn't it encrypted?

It is encrypted by default but end-to-end is only for calls and Secret Chats (one-on-one). You can delete any message at any time without a trace for both sides, which protesters often do, really don't think the government needs messages to pin a crime on them. Hell, they've pinned crimes on people for literally no reason before.

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#72

Post by baybal2 »

mercacona wrote: post #15
victords wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don’t think they do. I really think that’s just a personal project of a Russian billionaire that has enough free time and pretty much unlimited resources.

Yeah, that’s what their website claims. But it isn’t.

Public estimates of his net worth are hard to believe.

Not a billionaire, at most 2-3 hundred megabucks cash as his Russian assets are rendered effectively worthless, and he burned himself a lot trying himself in investments, real estate, and, in general, burning money on expensive things, including telegram, like no tomorrow.

I am still very suspicious at how he managed to flout around Kremlin for so long.

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#73

Post by input_sh »

mbowcutt wrote: post #53
rectang wrote: post #44

Should the revolution fail, the digital trail left by these messages will give the government everything they need to hunt down every last activist. We saw it with the Green Revolution in Iran. We've seen it several times since. So long as messages are not encrypted, messaging apps are much more naturally suited as tools of oppression than tools of revolution.

I don't know too much about Telegram but isn't it encrypted?

By default it's no more encrypted than HN (as in, traffic to their servers uses TLS, messages on the server are not encrypted at all).

There's Secret Chats feature which they claim to be end-to-end encrypted, meaning that it's no more secure than Facebook's Messenger (also end-to-end encrypted in Secret Conversations). Even less so considering that they roll their own encryption (MTProto), while Facebook's Messenger uses Signal's protocol.

Further info (which will also lead you to problems with their MTProto protocol, if you're interested): https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/49782/is-telegr...

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#74

Post by RangerScience »

myth_drannon wrote: post #59

There was also a very large Telegram channel where they were doxing riot police members that were participating in attacks on demonstrators. It was extremely efficient infowar since it was their home addresses, family photos, wife's cellphone number...

Wait seriously? Where can I find out more?

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#75

Post by Nasrudith »

soufron wrote: post #10

It's never "the work of a long-preparing revolutionnary crowd" revolution, but always a "latest fashionable technology" revolution. Tech propaganda at its best.

To be fair "long preparing revolutionary" people tend to be dogmatic loons who are obsessed with some pure concept (religious fundamentalism, communism, ethnonationalism) that aren't enough to be a crowd.

As opposed to a general populace pushed to an edge by extreme conditions and leadership which does the exact wrong thing in a circumstance.

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#76

Post by shawnz »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #42
soufron wrote: post #10

It's never "the work of a long-preparing revolutionnary crowd" revolution, but always a "latest fashionable technology" revolution. Tech propaganda at its best.

Long-preparing revolutionaries need a way to communicate and coordinate with a bunch of people who suddenly see things their way. The government often tries to jam the lines of communication, so some alternate form of communication is often critical.

Telegram provides, at best, equal security and ease-of-use to previously existing solutions like Signal and Whatsapp, and in many cases worse security. Telegram didn't do anything to make this kind of technology more accessible or available.

So, the fact that it happens to be a popular solution for encrypted chat right now doesn't really speak to its necessity for any revolution like you and the article seem to be implying. Easy access to encryption technology in general, sure, but that doesn't specifically need to be Telegram.

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#77

Post by t0astbread »

mauflows wrote: post #63
mbowcutt wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know too much about Telegram but isn't it encrypted?

I'm pretty sure Signal at least doesn't encrypt at rest on your phone. So the drive would have to be encrypted as well, which is not default on Android

Apart from that, regardless if you're on Signal or Telegram if authorities get hold of a protester's identity on such an app and have the power to access the app's servers they can gradually uncover social networks by reading metadata (if I'm not mistaken).

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#78

Post by WilTimSon »

nikivi wrote: post #2

Very curious how Telegram plans to monetize the app eventually given their crypto thing didn't work out.

Seeing how averse they are to putting any kinds of ads on the platform, I think they might find the middle ground by helping make ads in channels go through the official route. Basically, right now, some channels post "sponsored posts", which nets them some payment. By getting involved, they could probably help people not get ripped off, take a small cut of the fee, and make those sponsored posts integrated a bit better, maybe highlighted somehow. So no ads in the app, only in some channels, so that people can leave if they hate the ads.

Re: Telegram messaging app proves crucial to Belarus protests

#79

Post by robertfw »

Nasrudith wrote: post #75
soufron wrote: post #10

It's never "the work of a long-preparing revolutionnary crowd" revolution, but always a "latest fashionable technology" revolution. Tech propaganda at its best.

To be fair "long preparing revolutionary" people tend to be dogmatic loons who are obsessed with some pure concept (religious fundamentalism, communism, ethnonationalism) that aren't enough to be a crowd. As opposed to a general populace pushed to an edge by extreme conditions and leadership which does the exact wrong thing in a circumstance.

> To be fair "long preparing revolutionary" people tend to be dogmatic loons who are obsessed with some pure concept

* citation needed

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