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Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

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Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#51

Post by aikinai »

gwittel wrote: post #30
old-gregg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently they're doing pretty well. Don't expect them to change course. But this created the opportunity for others. I have migrated to Affinity photo + Capture One. No regrets.

How did you find the migration? I’ve been resisting Lightroom upgrades as I don’t want the cloud stuff. But as raw support for new cameras falls off it’s getting harder since the two step DNG import is such a pain. Moving to Capture One or something else seems worthwhile. Tried Darktable but wasn’t a big fan.

I switched to Capture One and it’s so much better. The main factor is speed. Also allowing layers for all adjustments.

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#52

Post by userbinator »

When things like this happen, is it any wonder an increasing number of users are viewing any sort of "updates" with extreme apprehension? "It was working fine just before, and now I've lost everything. Why should I have even updated!?!?"

I still remember when the general advice was "do not upgrade/change what works, unless you need something in a later version", which then changed to "updates are recommended", followed by "updates are strongly recommended", and more recently, "updates are mandatory".

Adobe isn't alone, Microsoft had done worse not long ago --- with a forced update too:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18148376

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18189139

(On the flip side, at least you're able to run file recovery programs on a PC.)

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#53

Post by numpad0 »

bonoboTP wrote: post #25
flandry93 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of the apology, Adobe should not be allowed to simply dismiss that they deleted user files. In effect, due to Adobe negligence, they have destroyed user intellectual property. A signal and example needs to be made. Individual users can sue for damages -- lost value and opportunity -- illegal destruction of property. The computer fraud and abuse act could also be applied for criminal charges -- Adobe misuse…

Software licenses always disclaim any warranty, implied or explicit, it's all "AS IS" and you accept it when you click that Accept button upon installation. And honestly, it's good this way. If you want to secure your photos, make backups yourself or sign a contract with some company that will guarantee something. But once they are liable and can be sued, the service will be astronomically expensive.

> Software licenses always disclaim any warranty, implied or explicit, it's all "AS IS"

In practice it’s fine, IF, files in the users’ hands is the master, cloud is a copy and format used is some sort of open standards.

Lets say I sent a mail, attachment got lost, but it’s a copy, besides it’s just a jpg, so send it again. Okay.

These cloud SaaS offerings are different: they tries to make the cloud as master, in proprietary format.

So local side is the xerox copy, and you have to go through complimentary conversion service to export the original if you sir insist, and they may cease access to the files on the cloud and copies on your computer but it’s somehow “your fault“ when they do that.

That doesn’t work! Either they assume full responsibility for content they hold, or we hold every rights, as we did, as we should.

I have multiple occasion where OneDrive thought it needs to steal my files from home directories, then change mind and don’t upload, but decides to reflect the reality that it’s not on the cloud. “Where are my files?” my ass you wiped another Desktop folder!

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#54

Post by clumsysmurf »

darren_ wrote: post #11
akersten wrote: post #2

Slight sidebar: it's so frustrating that Adobe made the new Lightroom some cloud based monstrosity. For photographers with serious workflows involving local disks, we're now relegated to "Lightroom Classic" which makes me feel like I'll be discontinued in N years from now. I hope they change course and drop this whole cloud thing, the yearly subscription model is bad enough.

They've also pulled off an incredibly hostile move for paid users of older Lightrooms - they're refusing to update it for 64bit-only OS X. The app itself is 64bit (in fact, the app itself is _only_ 64bit), but its licensing/installer components are not. So if you update OS X, it's not guaranteed that Lightroom (that you paid for) will run, or if it does, how long it will continue running for. This isn't some ancient…

Its worse than that (from 2019)

"Adobe this week began sending some users of its Lightroom Classic, Photoshop, Premiere, Animate, and Media Director programs a letter warning them that they were no longer legally authorized to use the software they may have thought they owned."

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/a3xk3p/adobe-tells-users-...

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#56

Post by tustlem »

darren_ wrote: post #11
akersten wrote: post #2

Slight sidebar: it's so frustrating that Adobe made the new Lightroom some cloud based monstrosity. For photographers with serious workflows involving local disks, we're now relegated to "Lightroom Classic" which makes me feel like I'll be discontinued in N years from now. I hope they change course and drop this whole cloud thing, the yearly subscription model is bad enough.

They've also pulled off an incredibly hostile move for paid users of older Lightrooms - they're refusing to update it for 64bit-only OS X. The app itself is 64bit (in fact, the app itself is _only_ 64bit), but its licensing/installer components are not. So if you update OS X, it's not guaranteed that Lightroom (that you paid for) will run, or if it does, how long it will continue running for. This isn't some ancient…

Same happened with Adobe Premiere. I've been a Premiere user for the last 12 years but that change lost me. I've moved to Final Cut Pro because of it.

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#57

Post by jagged-chisel »

swiley wrote: post #34
FactolSarin wrote: post #10

Obviously this is a screw up on Adobe's part, but this is a good time to remind everyone that if you're not backing up your data, then it must not be very important to you. Back up your stuff! You never know when something unexpected will cause you to lose it!

Is there an alternative to iCloud for backing up the iPhone? I’ve kind of given up on checking what’s aloud this year.

Your computer.

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#58

Post by Animats »

flandry93 wrote: post #22
darren_ wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've also pulled off an incredibly hostile move for paid users of older Lightrooms - they're refusing to update it for 64bit-only OS X. The app itself is 64bit (in fact, the app itself is _only_ 64bit), but its licensing/installer components are not. So if you update OS X, it's not guaranteed that Lightroom (that you paid for) will run, or if it does, how long it will continue running for. This isn't some ancient…

Regardless of the apology, Adobe should not be allowed to simply dismiss that they deleted user files. In effect, due to Adobe negligence, they have destroyed user intellectual property. A signal and example needs to be made. Individual users can sue for damages -- lost value and opportunity -- illegal destruction of property. The computer fraud and abuse act could also be applied for criminal charges -- Adobe misuse…

This happened on the user's phone. The issue is at what point negligent authorized access becomes unauthorized access. "Exceeds authorized access" is a criminal charge under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. A contract cannot override criminal law. This is really complicated, see [1]. An EULA, though, might not be enough to get Adobe out of this.

Especially if a third party, not a party to the EULA, owned the photo. If, for example, a news photographer for a newspaper had a photo lost, and the photographer, but not the employer, had agreed to the EULA, the newspaper might sue.

This is an important point. If a third party who is not bound by the EULA suffers damages, they can sue for negligence. The EULA binds only those who have agreed to it.

[1] https://shawnetuma.com/cyber-law-resources/what-does-cfaa-me...

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#59

Post by klodolph »

userbinator wrote: post #52

When things like this happen, is it any wonder an increasing number of users are viewing any sort of "updates" with extreme apprehension? "It was working fine just before, and now I've lost everything. Why should I have even updated!?!?" I still remember when the general advice was "do not upgrade/change what works, unless you need something in a later version", which then changed to "updates are recommended", follow…

On the audio production side of things... people are still pretty skittish when it comes to upgrades. I like to think of an audio production system as an appliance rather than a computer.

There's a quote from George Sanger that goes something like "the difference between an appliance and a computer is that a computer breaks down more often". He was speaking about audio production. There's a photo in his book of a computer with a sign taped to it saying, in explicit words, to NOT upgrade the computer, because it is running GigaSampler and he would very much like to keep running GigaSampler.

Re: Lightroom app update wipes users' photos and presets, Adobe says not recoverable

#60

Post by dylan604 »

userbinator wrote: post #52

When things like this happen, is it any wonder an increasing number of users are viewing any sort of "updates" with extreme apprehension? "It was working fine just before, and now I've lost everything. Why should I have even updated!?!?" I still remember when the general advice was "do not upgrade/change what works, unless you need something in a later version", which then changed to "updates are recommended", follow…

This is what I came to comment as well. I understand security updates to prevent the haxors from taking over. Even still, I wait for these exact warnings that update are bad. The forced automatic updates are the scariest thing to me. Luckily, on the desktop, they still allow the user to update at their discretion. I never ever ever update my Adobe software in the middle of projects. I once updated in the middle of a feature film edit that was put on hold, but went back to it after an update to Premiere. There were enough oddities with the new version that made me roll back to a previous version.
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