Rideshare operations are being suspended in California • Hacker News Board

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#371

Post by fizzled » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:23 PM UTC

ccffpphh wrote: post #347

lefrenchy wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is where the gig economy shines, when people want to use it to make extra money on the side or push to achieve financial goals. However, by your own admission you did it because you were "bored" and wanted to make some money. Unfortunately many gig workers don't have the privilege. I'm assuming here but you probably had another job and benefits. There are many workers who don't, and are turning to Uber or Lyft j…

What were these people doing before Uber and Lyft came around?

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Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#372

Post by taurath » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:23 PM UTC

wrkrinsec99 wrote: post #358

subdane wrote: post #31

Am I nuts, or is the heart of this issue really the fact that our healthcare system is built on tying benefits to full time jobs?

Both parties have supported Fed leadership that relied on worker insecurity to keep people in their jobs: https://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/27/business/job-insecurity-o... America does not have a stories history of being labor friendly. It’s pretty much old European pissing competitions imported anew after WW2. Identity which the country had begun to schlep off between the Gilded Age and WW1. Refugees brought it back o…

Were I rich right now, being educated enough to understand history, and looking at the relative income gap being larger than the french revolution, I'd be wanting to redistribute some wealth right now myself, lest it be taken by force. A 3% wealth tax seems "extreme" right now, but it will be preferable if the wedge making the poor fight each other breaks down.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#373

Post by ska » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:23 PM UTC

whoisjuan wrote: post #111

subdane wrote: post #31

Am I nuts, or is the heart of this issue really the fact that our healthcare system is built on tying benefits to full time jobs?

I keep paying my health insurance premium at my home country just because the health insurance in the US is completely broken. I feel that if you get seriously sick in the US you're in an almost sure path to financial insolvency. My employer pays probably a shit ton of money for my health insurance and what I get is the most subpar, confusing, broken and sometimes blatantly extortive service ever. I live in Austin an…

One glance once you cross over to Nuevo Laredo will show you this isn't a novel thought. Especially for dental and smallish out-patient procedures.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#374

Post by raizinho » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:23 PM UTC

rsweeney21 wrote: post #129

subdane wrote: post #31

Am I nuts, or is the heart of this issue really the fact that our healthcare system is built on tying benefits to full time jobs?

This is an interesting idea. Is this an unintended consequence of binding health insurance to your employment? According to the NYT: "During World War II, federal wage controls prevented employers from wooing workers with higher pay, so companies started offering health insurance as a way around the law. Of course, this form of nonmonetary compensation is still pay. When the war ended, the practice stuck." I would mu…

I'm surprised that you'd suggest that "businesses brought this on themselves." It's a cut and dry government failure.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#375

Post by amoitnga » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:24 PM UTC

amoitnga wrote: post #369

They spent ton of money to get me to install their app and consider it as an option. There is really no reason for me to use one over the other. Lyft, uber, some random taxi app.. Same drives are coming in the same cars. Now they are motivating me to look for alternatives and actually give 'some random taxi app' a name. this combined with "dont attribute to malice what can be attributed to stupidity" leads me to doub…

P.S point being they are going to lose market share with no good reason.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#376

Post by pm90 » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:24 PM UTC

shekispeaks wrote: post #354

Lyft is being petty here. I understand that they cannot make all drivers employees, but they could have some drivers on the road and not pulled the rug on users. This goes to say that you cannot trust private companies like Lyft for critical services. The government actually has been transparent about this change and Lyft is acting like a spoilt child, not even willing to try the employee route. Lyft pulling the rug…

They did this in Austin as well.

Easy to do now, considering the rideshare volumes are probably lower than without SIP.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#377

Post by rectang » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:24 PM UTC

subdane wrote: post #31

Am I nuts, or is the heart of this issue really the fact that our healthcare system is built on tying benefits to full time jobs?

Health insurance is a major component. However, the broader theme is the offloading of risk from the company onto their workers, including not only health risk but also for example, accident risk.

Most rideshare drivers are not properly insured — while passengers are well-covered, the drivers and their vehicles are not. Because the drivers are contractors and must navigate the insurance system as individuals, many do not possess adequate knowledge and statistically speaking, a large number are guaranteed to make mistakes when purchasing coverage.

If drivers were employees, then accident coverage for drivers and their vehicles becomes the responsibility of the rideshare companies. There would be fewer bad outcomes for drivers, but because the rideshare companies would bear greater risk, their profits would be reduced.

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#378

Post by kyrra » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:24 PM UTC

rsweeney21 wrote: post #129

subdane wrote: post #31

Am I nuts, or is the heart of this issue really the fact that our healthcare system is built on tying benefits to full time jobs?

This is an interesting idea. Is this an unintended consequence of binding health insurance to your employment? According to the NYT: "During World War II, federal wage controls prevented employers from wooing workers with higher pay, so companies started offering health insurance as a way around the law. Of course, this form of nonmonetary compensation is still pay. When the war ended, the practice stuck." I would mu…

Another big bit is tax deductions. I believe when the employer provides healthcare, the amount they pay and the employee pays is 100% pre-tax.

If you pay for medical insurance yourself, it starts getting complicated[0]. They honestly just need to make it so any medical insurance payments should be 100% deductible, regardless of anything else. It would help level the playing field.

[0] https://www.investopedia.com/are-health-insurance-premiums-t...

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#379

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:25 PM UTC

shekispeaks wrote: post #354

Lyft is being petty here. I understand that they cannot make all drivers employees, but they could have some drivers on the road and not pulled the rug on users. This goes to say that you cannot trust private companies like Lyft for critical services. The government actually has been transparent about this change and Lyft is acting like a spoilt child, not even willing to try the employee route. Lyft pulling the rug…

[deleted]

Re: Rideshare operations are being suspended in California

#380

Post by axlee » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 6:25 PM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #325

lefrenchy wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is where the gig economy shines, when people want to use it to make extra money on the side or push to achieve financial goals. However, by your own admission you did it because you were "bored" and wanted to make some money. Unfortunately many gig workers don't have the privilege. I'm assuming here but you probably had another job and benefits. There are many workers who don't, and are turning to Uber or Lyft j…

Driving jobs already exist if that’s what they wanted. Turning ridesharing into full-time employment doesn't solve anything other than removing the freelance opportunity for many who find it fits their situation best.

> Nobody is being forced into anything. They're choosing this because it's the best opportunity.

That is such a lazy take. Of course people are forced to take whatever job is available: humans need food, shelter and healthcare. If society doesn't collectively agree about a minimum standard of what a job entails, you inevitably ends up with the "bottom of the barrel" living in inhumane conditions. As a society, it is our duty to lift up the standards, not lower them and trample on the already destitute.