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Can't you just right click?

lapcatsoftware.com

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Re: Can't you just right click?

#211

Post by _qulr »

dwaite wrote: post #194
cytzol wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The blog post was written in the context of the widely reported story of Apple threatening to terminate the developer account of Epic Games, which would prevent them from signing and notarizing their Mac software. This part is key. It shows that Apple's signing and notarising requirement isn't about money, nor is it about security. Epic broke the rules of the iOS store, and now they'll be forbidden from developing…

I suspect they will fix their app before this deadline. I very much doubt a judge will rule in Epic's favor for an injunction to removal when they have so obviously orchestrated this problem themselves. Apple has a single developer program for all platforms. Epic has been given a deadline to stop breaking the contract terms - submit a new version of the application which reverts the remotely activated payment logic.

> Apple has a single developer program for all platforms.

This is the fundamental problem, in my opinion.

When Developer ID was introduced, it was supposed to be a mere formality, a cryptographic guarantee that an app was signed by a particular developer, to be used only for security purposes. At the time, nobody knew it would be used as leverage in an App Store dispute.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#212

Post by saagarjha »

wruza wrote: post #152

I thought that a developer status will autosave me either from malware or from being babysitted, but then [1] happened. No matter how hard I tried to start that binary, OSX didn't allow me to do that. Damn OS which knows better, who do yo think you are? Did you see checksums, site certs, my competence, my willpower? I thought that it must be something with a build process that transmission uses, some signature didn't…

You will note that macOS identified the software as malware 1. because it was actually malware and 2. without notarization.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#213

Post by ineedasername »

cuddlybacon wrote: post #6

This feature is at about the right spot for me. It is still convenient enough for me to run software I want that isn't signed, but sufficiently obtuse that neither of my parents have figured it out. Given they are both prone to running any executable that any website tells them to download and run, this feature has probably save me several dozen hours of fixing their computers.

From the article, it seems like things have gradually become more & more restrictive though. My interpretation is that Apple is gradually shifting macOS to the same application distribution model as iOS: Complete walled garden, attempts to bypass are against ToS, actively closed off with every update, and warranty-breaking.

However my impression is also that it's mostly non Mac users who are concerned with this, so it seems unlikely that Apple will have much incentive to reverse course unless they screw up and go a few steps too far too soon and create a bigger outcry. Even that would probably just delay the process.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#214

Post by aaomidi »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #51
aaomidi wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any open source developer? Do you know how much $100 is in Iran?

I just looked it up, and it seems like $100 is worth less than half a week of an average developers salary in Iran.

Makes sense. Irancell pays around $350-450/month with today's exchange rate.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#215

Post by DoreenMichele »

aaomidi wrote: post #207
DoreenMichele wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was no intent at all to be disrespectful. The comment caught my eye in part because I have something of a personal interest in Iran. I used to speak regularly with an Iranian who was, among other things, a software developer. My general impression is that money was not nearly as big a problem as other things, thanks to the embargo. Your comments don't quite fit with my understanding of things, which could be ju…

I moved to the US just a few years ago. Iran's economy has changed significantly in the past few years. University professors that used to make around ~60K USD a year just a decade ago are now making 8-12K USD a year today. Money is definitely a problem, and even if you have the money dealing with American companies completely closing off everything is a pain. Thankfully Android, being a little bit more open than App…

Thank you.

It's been a few years since I've had any contacts in Iran. I wasn't aware the economy had gotten so much worse, so my apologies. My information is out of date, apparently.

I did look up some things about the embargo and open source platforms at one time. My knowledge of programming is limited. I know a little CSS and HTML and I run some websites, but I don't really think of myself as a "programmer." So I probably can't meaningfully add anything here.

I'm generally on your side. Thank you for the interesting comment.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#216

Post by aaomidi »

saagarjha wrote: post #75
dec0dedab0de wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just looked it up, and it seems like $100 is worth less than half a week of an average developers salary in Iran.

$100 can be an hour of a developer's salary here, or even less. The relative cost is quite large. (Oh, and guess who isn't making a developer's salary in Iran? Someone who is just starting out, or an open source developer, or someone who is currently unemployed…)

Literally no one in Iran is paying $100/hr.

I looked at your website you have linked on your bio as well. You've never even worked in Iran.

Stop lying.

Edit: this comment was a misunderstanding, ignore please.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#217

Post by lukeschlather »

josephg wrote: post #130
badsectoracula wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This works for some type of software, but not all type of software. For example a file server or a file manager wont work. A VCS client wont work. A game engine that needs to keep track of imported resources (especially when you want automatic imports when the file is saved via a 3rd party tool - e.g. saving a model on Blender or a texture on Krita causes an automatic reimport/convert to the engine's format). Basical…

Sure it does! We just need sufficiently granular permissions for all of this stuff. “Do you want to give ClipboardManager access to your clipboard?” Yes. “Do you want to give TikTok access to your clipboard?” No. I agree that clicking a million permission boxes is annoying but ideally it should only be something needed for apps that don’t fit the media consumption model. The real problem is that the desktop security…

> I agree that clicking a million permission boxes is annoying but ideally it should only be something needed for apps that don’t fit the media consumption model.

Media consumption apps are nice and good but I think pretty much all innovation is dependent on media production apps. A permissions model that treats media consumption as the most important use case will necessarily inhibit artistic expression and utility.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#218

Post by m463 »

lucb1e wrote: post #2

This makes me wonder how open source is supposed to work on macOS. People seem to become more and more aware of it and even enterprises that insisted on support contracts can see that they can't get around open source completely anymore. Meanwhile Apple is removing the ability for me to have a pet project without paying an Apple tax. If the message were completely transparent, something like "The developer didn't pay…

I remember RMS saying that the GPL was updated because one "obvious" freedom was not so obvious -- you could meet all the requirements of the GPL, without giving the right to RUN the software.

GPL3 allows that. And looking backwards, apple shipped software that was GPL2, but would not ship software that was GPL3. As one example, bash and make all quietly stopped getting updates from apple when the GPL3 versions came out. (although apple sort of broke GPL with bash as it never shipped all the source for it -- missing the header file rootless.h)

One other point about these dialogs + the help message. You are required to contact apple to even see this online help. Apple deals itself into the equation no matter what.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#219

Post by saagarjha »

dwaite wrote: post #165
cytzol wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As much as we all like to call out Apple sometimes for how they don't take good care of their developers, adding hoops for your developers to jump through is not a great idea. Why not? Apple has been pushing very hard lately to increase their 'services' revenue, by getting users to sign up for Apple Music, iCloud, etc. It makes perfect sense for Apple to force developers to jump through hoops, not because it makes…

> • When launching Chrome for the first time, you have to opt-in to Chrome notifications, but macOS pops up its own notification telling you to use Safari instead. Link to a screenshot of this Safari notification when Chrome is run? > Similarly, Apple News notifications are allowed by default, but you have to explicitly opt-in to notifications from other news websites. Reference to an article about this? > • System P…

Not when Chrome is run, it shows up at some point after you start using your Mac.

Re: Can't you just right click?

#220

Post by saagarjha »

dwaite wrote: post #180
jojobas wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more of a choke hold than a cash grab. Your app broke our store rules, we removed it and you're suing us? We'll terminate your dev account so your apps won't run.

Assuming you mean Epic, Apple has only given a deadline to cease breaking their developer agreement before their developer account is terminated. Epic is empowered to get their app back in the store tomorrow if they want to release an updated build without the contract-infringing functionality. They probably have lost their chance to be features by Apple or to be invited back on stage in future keynotes, but at least…

You mean the contract that Epic claims is illegal? Why would they want to voluntarily go back to that contract?
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