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Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

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341–350 of 1001 posts

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#341

There is a crossfit gym that I pass by every morning on the way to work. It is full, and never stopped during this pandemic. Even at 7AM, it is full of patrons. I would call the "proper authorities", but since there is a State Police car parked outside every morning, and he is in there working out, just like before the pandemic, I doubt calling anyone would do anything. Adding to the post, I read it earlier... it is…

> I find it amazing we can not see short term sacrifice for long term gain.

That seems to be a very widespread societal issue. Feedback and gratification are very effective conditioning loops and it applies to basically everything directly socially linked. Advertising, education, law enforcement. Everything which shapes anothe life whether done knowing or unknowingly and can come to bite the conditioner one way or another. Like the "tiger mom nightmare" case of forcing a son through med school only for him to show it to his mom say "There I am done it, happy now?" and working in a convenience store because of the sheer weight of negative conditioned meant that poverty was preferrable to six figure income and working days calling back decades of resentment.

Defying it successfully is a way to make or save money and everyone hates it essentially is rare and doing so is an outright resentment magnet. The majority will dislike anyone who points it out as a potential component to a solution. It gets one outright dehumanized even for optimizations innocous as meal prepping the same balanced and cheap meal daily to save up for something.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#342
post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find it amazing we can not see short term sacrifice for long term gain. Maybe because nobody successfully proved to these people (me included) that this sacrifice is useful. You can't tell to people, you have no risk of dying (0.5% death rate for population, much much lower for healthy and young people), people who are at risk of dying can protect themselves even around sick people (wearing a mask, staying at hom…

US didn't have a federal strategy to deal with the pandemic. They shot at their own foot and didn't give themselves a chance to be successful. The rest of the (developed, and many underdeveloped) world dealt with it and are moving on. I'm watching Champions league finals on TV and Wuhan pool party clips on twitter, thinking wtf went wrong here.

The Champions League finals definitely aren't an indication this part of the world has dealt with it and is moving on. There's a huge amount of intrusive Covid-19 restrictions around those, from obvious things like no spectators to putting the entire teams in isolation (compliance has been... mixed), and even then I have my doubts that they'd be able to finish the season if it went on any longer due to the exponential growth in cases again in Europe.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to believe that the scientific and medical authorities who are being consulted by local and state leadership have done exactly that calculation... and that result was states mandating that these businesses be shut down. Why do randos think they understand the threat model better than the CDC and state medical authorities?

> Why do randos think they understand the threat model better than the CDC and state medical authorities? This is HN. We get a post on at least a weekly basis to the effect of: medications shouldn’t require prescriptions, anyone with an internet connection and a couple brain cells can manage their own care. HN: home of “no one in management can possibly understand the technical complexity of software” and “who needs…

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Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#344
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to go if you don't want to. Surely your indignation would be better directed at employers, schools and others who are requiring in-person attendance.

I'm okay with this answer as long as the people who go to the gym aren't allowed in the grocery store, bank, on public transport.... Because I do have to go there whether I want to or not. Give any gym-goer a 2 week temporary tattoo on their forehead so I know to avoid them. Then we're cool.

You'll have to talk to your local grocery store or bank manager about that.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#345

There is a crossfit gym that I pass by every morning on the way to work. It is full, and never stopped during this pandemic. Even at 7AM, it is full of patrons. I would call the "proper authorities", but since there is a State Police car parked outside every morning, and he is in there working out, just like before the pandemic, I doubt calling anyone would do anything. Adding to the post, I read it earlier... it is…

>>>I would call the "proper authorities" Why? What harm is going on here? If you don’t like it, don’t participate. Leave us alone, narc.

higher chance of infection. you don't live in a vacuum.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering most states have been in full on shelter in place lock down mode, there aren't many places people can socialize anyways. All of the normal places where you see people socialize have bee closed or went out business. Restaurants, bars, night clubs, sporting events, live music (festivals and stadiums) and many, many others. It would be one thing to conform to what your saying, but its become hard if not impo…

Parks? Backyards? A walk around the neighborhood? Outdoor dining? If you can't socialize outside a bar, that's on you.

In a lot of urban environments access to the obvious outdoor alternatives is pretty limited.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#347
post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I’m not out there licking their face. Isn’t distancing, the plexiglass screens, and mask wearing supposed to fix my risk to others? If memory serves, the probability of transmission is under 1% with those measures.

For the sake of an example, allow me to assume (a) there are 10 people in your class, (b) each of you has an average of one other "risky outing" (shop at a store, one meeting with coworkers, visit another household) a day, and (c) each outing has a 0.5% risk of transmission assuming the boxer's infected. If anyone in your group gets infected, there's a good chance you'll all catch it (you seem to acknowledge this). I…

Thanks for putting this thought experiment into numbers, even if they are arbitrary. It really helps to form some estimation of a mental model, and shows how goddamn complex all of this is.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#348
post #159
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I go to a boxing class in the park. We meet 2x/week and train together. You can’t distance while boxing. Here’s my threat model: - we’re all young, healthy, and in good shape - we all wear masks during normal life, some of us even while training - we all social distance and follow the right protocols outside of boxing - it’s always the same group of people - 2x/week seems like low enough frequency that exposure won’t…

It seems like an acceptable level of risk to me as well. But is it an acceptable level to all the people you counteract with say within a week? Is the cashier at your supermarket, that lives with their 6+ family members, ok with you doing this? Is your elderly neighbour that also uses your elevator OK with this? This is the moral and societal conundrum we are in.

For some, its very easy to get consent of all the people they interact with in a week.

I have no supermarket cashier to request consent of; amazon fresh contactless delivery.

I live a pretty wealthy lifestyle away from the coasts, no shared elevators here.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. The last couple months has done more damage than good to me. I'm that type of person who'll lose muscle quickly if stops working out for mote than 2 weeks. I also played a couple games of volleyball and tennis, and I'm so clumsy I'm embarrassed I lost control of my body. Meanwhile, thr local gyms havr silly rules to restrict people's access...

The last couple months has done more damage than good to me. I'm that type of person who'll lose muscle quickly if stops working out for mote than 2 weeks. It's not about you. It's about everyone else. How can someone be so selfish and self-absorbed that they think their "muscle mass" is more important than the health of hundreds or thousands of other people? I know this question may violate some HN policy, but I can…

I am neutral towards your comment, but I feel you're judging me for my beliefs and opinions, even though you don't know where I come from and what's important for me.

Re: Secret gyms and the economics of prohibition

#350

There is a crossfit gym that I pass by every morning on the way to work. It is full, and never stopped during this pandemic. Even at 7AM, it is full of patrons. I would call the "proper authorities", but since there is a State Police car parked outside every morning, and he is in there working out, just like before the pandemic, I doubt calling anyone would do anything. Adding to the post, I read it earlier... it is…

Proper authorities, photo of car, and a set of local news organisations, plus a few tweets and your state reps, might get some attention.

Play interests off each other.

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