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Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

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Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#11

Post by tptacek »

vecinu wrote: post #4

I'm so happy to hear this. I cannot stand tipping and genuinely get anxiety when I'm out with friends and the wife and she sometimes pays without knowing what the right "tip amount" is. It happens to me too, where I have to pay attention to what the waiter/waitress is doing that is exceptional or bad so I can adjust my tip accordingly. It's bad for the customer and the employee, the employer is the only one winning b…

You do not in fact have to pay attention to how well the server performs. You can just take the final price, divide by 10, multiply by 2, and round whichever direction you want. You should look at tipping as a cost sharing measure, not an incentive system.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#12

Post by EffToyz »

tony101 wrote: post #7
jszymborski wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and while we're at it, include the taxes!

I think separately listing taxes has the benefit of transparency - you know how much the government is taking and can make more informed electoral decisions.

I wish they made it in LCBO reciepts, so we could see that sweet almost 100% tax on alcohol.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#13

Post by petre »

smnrchrds wrote: post #2

No, they did not. It is more accurate to say two restaurants in Toronto just mandated 18% tipping: > Tips will still be split between front and back but Ten will now be "adding a flat untaxed 18 per cent service charge onto each bill no matter the size of the group," The more sensible thing would have been to increase menu prices by 18%. But they are not being sensible. They just increased their prices while pretendi…

18% price increase during a pandemic? Wow. They have it in Hungary too, but it's 8% as far as I can remember, not 18%. But we didn't mind as in Budapest the service and the food was almost always excellent, even in a bar that served mainly cocktails but had some easy dishes so that the customer doesn't leave the place if they're hungry.

I don't like service tax. If you don't like the service you have no other option but to pay it. With tips you would just not tip and walk away.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#14

Post by dwohnitmok »

tptacek wrote: post #11
vecinu wrote: post #4

I'm so happy to hear this. I cannot stand tipping and genuinely get anxiety when I'm out with friends and the wife and she sometimes pays without knowing what the right "tip amount" is. It happens to me too, where I have to pay attention to what the waiter/waitress is doing that is exceptional or bad so I can adjust my tip accordingly. It's bad for the customer and the employee, the employer is the only one winning b…

You do not in fact have to pay attention to how well the server performs. You can just take the final price, divide by 10, multiply by 2, and round whichever direction you want. You should look at tipping as a cost sharing measure, not an incentive system.

Fascinating. Are we now at 20-23% (exclusive of taxes, as I think they're usually calculated, so the variance here is entirely how much meals tax you have on your meal) tip rates as the new normal?

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#15

Post by tptacek »

lostgame wrote: post #3

Good riddance. Tipping is racist/sexist, and is more often than not an excuse for the restaurants to use it for exploitation. I live in Toronto and everyone I know working in the food industry is happy to hear this.

It isn't hard to find servers who do support tipping; especially in high-end and fine dining, it's relatively lucrative.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#16

Post by BoorishBears »

tptacek wrote: post #11
vecinu wrote: post #4

I'm so happy to hear this. I cannot stand tipping and genuinely get anxiety when I'm out with friends and the wife and she sometimes pays without knowing what the right "tip amount" is. It happens to me too, where I have to pay attention to what the waiter/waitress is doing that is exceptional or bad so I can adjust my tip accordingly. It's bad for the customer and the employee, the employer is the only one winning b…

You do not in fact have to pay attention to how well the server performs. You can just take the final price, divide by 10, multiply by 2, and round whichever direction you want. You should look at tipping as a cost sharing measure, not an incentive system.

It just occurred to me maybe the reason some people find tipping so stressful, is that they think they're supposed to be grading someone with it.

Because in the US it's not like taxes are included either, and and the "default" tipping percentage is much easier to calculate than tax percentages.

I've lived in countries that tip and don't tip, it's honestly not a huge deal. The fact the menu says a service charge is included or not doesn't really change much at all.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#17

Post by simonbarker87 »

sudeepj wrote: post #8

As someone from India, I never understood the the tipping culture when I went abroad. It is not that tips are non-existent in India. It is not mandatory in India. However in UK, any tip I was surprised even getting a simple haircut had to be tipped in UK. I do not mind if the appropriate tip amount is factored in the price itself. The guilty-feeling and ambiguity whether I am being miserly or not made me avoid such p…

I’m British. I’m sorry you feel this way. It’s the thing I hate the most about visiting the US. I’m going say this once and really big for you:

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO TIP IN THE UK.

You can if you want but, having worked in the service sector, it is not expected, service staff won’t think worse of you and please don’t feel guilty.

Unlike the US we have a vaguely liveable minimum wage that is nearly £10 per hour now and tipping is absolutely not required.

I only tip when the service was excellent or the person actually went above and beyond.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#18

Post by Smoosh »

tony101 wrote: post #7
jszymborski wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and while we're at it, include the taxes!

I think separately listing taxes has the benefit of transparency - you know how much the government is taking and can make more informed electoral decisions.

With a single Federal Goods and Services Tax (GST) as in Australia, you know it is 10%. All prices include the GST and are the price you will pay. There are no other sales taxes. Everyone knows what the government's cut is. Everyone knows how much they are actually paying. I can't see why anyone would want a more complicated system.

Clarification: Many "essential" goods like simple foods are GST exempt. They will be marked as such on the receipt. Again, the price on the shelf or box is what you will actually pay. There are no hidden surprises.

Though there are still some special cases where they sneak in extra taxes - stamp duty on houses and import duties on cars for example.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#19

Post by tptacek »

dwohnitmok wrote: post #14
tptacek wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do not in fact have to pay attention to how well the server performs. You can just take the final price, divide by 10, multiply by 2, and round whichever direction you want. You should look at tipping as a cost sharing measure, not an incentive system.

Fascinating. Are we now at 20-23% (exclusive of taxes, as I think they're usually calculated, so the variance here is entirely how much meals tax you have on your meal) tip rates as the new normal?

15-20% has been the norm for my whole adult life, and the upper range (1) doesn't often materially change the price of a meal and (2) simplifies the math. Use whatever system you want, though; the point is: you are not actually on the hook to evaluate the server's performance. Think of it as tipping the institution of table service.

Re: Two more restaurants in Toronto just got rid of tipping

#20

Post by untog »

smnrchrds wrote: post #2

No, they did not. It is more accurate to say two restaurants in Toronto just mandated 18% tipping: > Tips will still be split between front and back but Ten will now be "adding a flat untaxed 18 per cent service charge onto each bill no matter the size of the group," The more sensible thing would have been to increase menu prices by 18%. But they are not being sensible. They just increased their prices while pretendi…

> The more sensible thing would have been to increase menu prices by 18%.

That would not be sensible because when people are comparing restaurants they will appear 18% more expensive than an identically priced competition when they aren’t.

> I hate it when you have to treat a menu like a legal document

I don’t know why you’d need to. I’ve travelled in Europe plenty, where restaurants charge a service charge. It’s right there in the receipt. I don’t know why this would be any different.

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