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How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

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Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#201

Post by dang »

Alupis wrote: post #192
La1n wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your previous comment that said this is flagged and dead. It's not good practice to repost it, even if you add a bit of text that is still not fact based.

> even if you add a bit of text that is still not fact based It seems shilling for the CCP is easy to do when you refuse to recognize the credibility problem of CCP data sources. We've seen these types on HN before. The ones who's accounts are 90% filled with Pro CCP comments - clearly shilling for the CCP. Ones like yours, La1n. CCP lies about the number of COVID-19 deaths - lies about how it spread - lies about GDP…

You can't attack other users like this on HN. The poison of imaginary accusations of astroturfing/shilling (and believe me, they are almost all imaginary—I've looked at this data closely and it's impossible to come to any other conclusion) does vastly more damage to this site than the phenomena you're complaining about. Please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and don't post like this again. This was a particularly bad case.

I've written a great deal about this if you want some explanation about why we moderate HN this way (no, it's not because we're secret Communists):

https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...

https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&type=comment&dateRange=a...

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#202

Post by [deleted] »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #191
BurningFrog wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is a non stupid child ban policy you support that doesn't cause harm?

Global sterilization of all people by molecular-genetic means. Then temporarily unsterilizing by winning the lottery, points, ability score, merit, money, whatever... Simple, innit?

[deleted]

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#204

Post by skido8 »

evancox100 wrote: post #17

Anyone else catch this? First: “The Chinese government says its distant-water fishing fleet, or those vessels that travel far from China’s coast, numbers roughly 2,600, but other research, such as this study by the Overseas Development Institute (ODI), puts this number closer to 17,000”. Several paragraphs later: “More recently, the Chinese government has stopped calling for an expansion of its distant-water fishing…

Dead chinese = good chinese

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#205

Post by huffmsa »

crucio wrote: post #121
noworriesnate wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need supplements to grow healthily as a vegetarian. For example, it's difficult to get Omega 3, 6 and 9 from plants. You need supplements for that. Also you've only been vegetarian a year. Being a vegetarian from birth to death without supplements would be much more difficult to do without major deficiencies. Also vegetarians today have the option of buying food from all over the world, but that wasn't the case f…

You are spreading misinformation. Everyone needs Omega 3/6/9. You can get it from nuts and algae. IF you want to be inefficient and introduce a middleman, you can get it from fish. B12 is needed by everyone. The meat you eat has it supplemented. Again, you can cut out the middleman and get it directly as a supplement rather than having a cow killed.

Growing 1lb of almonds requires ~1900 gallons of water.

Beef is ~1800lbs.

Not particularly efficient is it

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#206

Post by crucio »

oblio wrote: post #126
crucio wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Typical response of HN to downvote comments like the parents, just because it's doesn't suit their own lifestyle.

I didn't downvote him but I think I know why he was downvoted. Denying human reality doesn't work. Remember the Prohibition?

Remember when segregation was normal? Remember when slavery was normal? Remember when women had no rights? A growing and large amount of people believe abuse against animals and the environment follows on perfectly. You can be part of the change or blindly ignore it because it doesn't suit how you were brought up.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#207

Post by MagnumOpus »

dirtyid wrote: post #164
bamboozled wrote: post #110

Is the world just going to have to let China own itself to learn the hard way? Like, it just seems like a bad news generator and we constantly need to dance around the CCP trying to guide them appropriately with sanctions, and threats and incentives. I understand depleting the oceans would be catastrophic, but how is this regime ever going to learn? Honest question?

> bad news generator Well someone has to choose what bad news to highlight and how biased to highlight said news. For example, per capita, Taiwan and S.Korea have larger DWF fleets, Taiwan significantly so. Factor in EEZ and you get a good idea of why. China: 1400m ppl / 3000 dwf fleet / 900,000km2 eez (3.8m with disputes) Taiwan: 24m / 414 / 90,000km2 Japan: 162m / 162 / 4,500,000km2 S.Korea: 52m / 198 / 300,00km2 S…

Except if you even read the first line of the article, China has an unreported additional DWF fleet of another 14,000 vessels.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#208

Post by MagnumOpus »

freeopinion wrote: post #183

Being completely ignorant of the fishing industry, these numbers of vessels seem crazy high. I had no idea. Let's say the Chinese have 15-20,000. What percentage is that of the entire industry? Are there 100,000 distant-water vessels active in the world? Or only 25,000 total? If the Chinese represent 20% of the world industry, but are trying to feed 18% of the world's population, that doesn't seem outrageous. But if…

> Let's say the Chinese have 15-20,000. What percentage is that of the entire industry

For comparison, the 2nd/3rd/4th largest distant-water fleets are Taiwan at around 400 and Japan and S. Korea at around 150-200 [0]. Probably the entire rest of the world accounts for less than 10% of foreign fishing.

[0] https://www.stimson.org/wp-content/files/file-attachments/St...

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#209

Post by dathinab »

BurningFrog wrote: post #113
dathinab wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It caused harn because it was stupidly implemented not because it's generally bad. But btw. many western countries have a shrinking population since years to a degree where that's an problem. But this also means that the countries which have to take (reasonable) actions include many contribute which often can't afford more reasonable actions :/

What is a non stupid child ban policy you support that doesn't cause harm?

Super hard to say.

But there are a fiew things you should definitely do:

- Make sure not gender is valued above the other gender.

- No 1 child limit (instead of 2), with a 1 child limit we would have two people having one child, i.e. halving. Which is probably faster shrinking then any country can properly handle (i.e. after a while a horrible ratio of young to old people etc.). A two child limit still will cause shrinkage.

- Don't fixate the law on women, it's unreasonable and put's a further burden on them.

- Make sure your social system isn't incompatible with such a law before enacting it.

- Make sure society is compatible with such a law before enacting it.

- Make sure it's not turned into a money making machine.

- Consider regional differences.

Which would be a view points you should keep to which china didn't bother with at all.

Most problems of the past one child policy in china come from:

- Man being valued much more then woman now leading to there being much more of them then woman.

- To fast shrinkage puts the social system in danger as to view young people have to care for to many old people.

- The laws being abusive to woman.

- The laws unreasonable handling of children which under the law should not have been born but have been born anyway.

EDIT: Just to be clear, there are many more ways to (slowly) shrink a countries population which are based on subtle nudging society in the intended direction instead of enforcing any hard limit on the number of children. Which is probably what China should have done, tbh.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#210

Post by dathinab »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #191
BurningFrog wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is a non stupid child ban policy you support that doesn't cause harm?

Global sterilization of all people by molecular-genetic means. Then temporarily unsterilizing by winning the lottery, points, ability score, merit, money, whatever... Simple, innit?

No, you must consider regional differences.

Any law which is not doing so and just enact it the same for any larger region (the world, or just whole of china) is bound to fail big time.

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