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Do I Need Kubernetes?

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Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#151

Post by MichaelMoser123 »

gravypod wrote: post #148
MichaelMoser123 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a script that simplifies creation of kind clusters with local registry and ingress https://github.com/MoserMichael/kind-helper (to make it more developer friendly that is) but i guess kind is more for automation testing purposes as it runs all modes in docker containers on the same machine.

Looks like a nice tool. If it could watch for changes, rebuild, repush, and restart pods it would be the perfect dev environment. Even still this looks like a great start. Have you thought about polishing it a little more and doing a Show HN?

Thanks, i think that building images and restarting pods would be a bit out of scope for this script, but you have examples in the tests for this project. For kubernetes cluster administration i have this project; https://github.com/MoserMichael/s9k

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#152

Post by shaklee3 »

escardin wrote: post #94
spost wrote: post #23

I work for a startup whose product is small (half a dozen servers, if relatively beefy ones) clusters that will be run on-prem by customers, at least sometimes in a low-to-no-touch capacity. Most of our application components are micro-ish services that are run on all hosts in the cluster for either extra capacity or fault tolerance. We currently run everything on mesos/marathon, but are looking to switch away from i…

I did an on-prem k8s deployment at my last place. It is definitely challenging compared to EKS and GKE, but the difficultly is not in base k8s. Following the kubeadm getting started guide on the kubernetes.io site can get you an 'ha', 'production ready' going in a couple hours. Most of it is pretty mechanical, and only needs a couple key decisions, mainly your networking plugin. Generally the most popular ones have i…

Kube-vip is another good alternative to metallb.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#153

Post by shaklee3 »

peterwwillis wrote: post #142
halbritt wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> do you have about a million dollars to spend on building and maintaining it all? Then you need Kubernetes. I think you're overstating the investment necessary to overcome the initial complication of Kubernetes and also understating the benefit of being on a platform with a massive and thriving community behind it. As an example, in a prior role, there were a set of data engineers that would receive data in the form…

What happens when your car's A/C stops working? Most people think, I'll just get a little can of R134a, fill up the system, and it'll be good as new. Somebody said they did that once and it worked just fine, so it should work for you too, right? I mean, it says so right on the can, and there's YouTube videos of it and everything. The trouble is, A/C is a complex system. There are moving pieces with specialized oils t…

I would strongly disagree. Etcd, for what it does, is extremely simple. What is so complex about it? The configuration?

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#154

Post by AlphaSite »

thom wrote: post #119
tootie wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ask every enterprise that existed prior to 2018? Even for small and mid-size enterprises, manual deploys aren't that huge of a deal. Automation with some bash scripts can get you pretty far. Especially if you're only managing a monolith or two. I've worked in some platforms that absolutely defied automation due to their proprietary nature. It just meant that we'd need a few people to spend 1-2 hours every two weeks t…

To be clear, I was more asking how people achieve the sort of fast bootstrapped dev environments the parent comment describes using k8s, especially where you’re not necessarily talking about simple topologies like a monolith plus a database.

Tilt is pretty great for dev workflows on k8s, they have affordances for debuggers, fast restarts without a full docker build, docker push, k8s delete pod workflow.

https://tilt.dev

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#155

Post by kissgyorgy »

I would say if you have the question "Do I need Kubernetes?", you don't need it because the benefits are not immediately crystal clear to you. Also, the author starts the evaluation from the wrong point of view, because the decision should be not so technical, but like everything else should be based on BUSINESS REQUIREMENTS. Evaluating Kubernetes is no different:

- Do you have such high traffic that you need a distributed system?

- Will a unified framework solve all your distribution problems?

- Do you really need high availability?

- Can you swallow the cost of high availability?

- Can you handle the insane complexity of Kubernetes at a reasonable cost?

You should not start asking questions about "Pods, Ingress" or anything Kubernetes specific, those are just implementation details.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#156

Post by devn0ll »

To me the question is more: Is there an extremely valid reason to _not_ use K8s.

As a freelancer I visit quite a number of enterprise companies, think: Banks, Insurance, Airports, and they are all making the switch or are full-on invested in living in K8s by default. If it does not run in or was not made with K8s in mind: It will not be used/bought.

Another thing I'm noticing with smaller companies: If you start fresh, you choose k8s. Which mens all other stuff is already slowly dying by virtue of not beeing chosen.

Developers want/expect it, sysadmins see the benefits from day one, and companies see the potential gains of using less cloud resources and a platform that could potentially run in multiple clouds for the first time ever.

K8s, openebs, prometheus/grafana, loki, kustomize, github actions. This is truly where "it's at" at the moment.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#157

Post by secondcoming »

lallysingh wrote: post #127
secondcoming wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I good reason not to use kubernetes though is if you know your app is probably never going to scale Suggesting that you can only scale with Kubernetes just isn't true. Our tech stack originally ran on AWS in multi-regions. Then we moved to GCP. The architecture was the same for both: - public facing Load Balancer - instance groups attached to the LB - add health checks so unresponsive instances get killed - add sca…

That isn't what parent suggested. The quotation is a reason not to use it.

The quotation has a double negative.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#158

Post by ClikeX »

ahmedfromtunis wrote: post #87
save_ferris wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people were amazed by the productivity gains Yeah, docker compose is great for running distributed apps locally when everything “just works”. The problem is that it also impedes development when the compose setup isn’t fully optimized. I work on dockerized rails apps, and whenever a new dependency is added, it can take 15 minutes to rebuild the image, which completely breaks my flow. Docker also creates a ton of da…

If I understood correctly, this means that every time you add a new dependency, it takes 15 minutes to rebuild the first time you `docker-compose up` right? I assume this is due to docker downloading the related image and running the container. If this is the case, isn't this orders of magnitude faster than adding the dependency manually. And aren't the gains are even more significant when we factor the fact that mos…

Adding Ruby dependencies (gems) is pretty trivial. And the Ruby package manager (bundler) only installs the new dependency if you do it on your own machine. In Docker it will do all of them.

It's worth noting that bundle uses a Gemfile, so it's not installing each Gem as a seperate step.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#159

Post by aliswe »

kissgyorgy wrote: post #155

I would say if you have the question "Do I need Kubernetes?", you don't need it because the benefits are not immediately crystal clear to you. Also, the author starts the evaluation from the wrong point of view, because the decision should be not so technical, but like everything else should be based on BUSINESS REQUIREMENTS. Evaluating Kubernetes is no different: - Do you have such high traffic that you need a distr…

> Can you handle the insane complexity of Kubernetes at a reasonable cost?

For me, this point is akin to asking "Can you handle the insane complexity of Linux at a reasonable cost?"

And what I mean by that is: If noone exists on your company who can administer it, then you shouldn't do it.

Re: Do I Need Kubernetes?

#160

Post by aliswe »

moomin wrote: post #74
overgard wrote: post #65

I think one of the underrated parts of using something like Kubernetes early (or even w/ simpler orchestrators like swarm or rancher), is that it encourages (and sometimes enforces) architecture best practices from the start. IE, you won't be storing state locally, you'll be able to handle servers being randomly killed, you'll already have horizontal scaling, etc. In my experience the hard part of migrating to contai…

Seriously though, the world needs a solution for Kubernetes like problems that involve UDP and multicast.

Do you mean that UDP capabilities are lacking on Kubernetes workloads? Serious question.
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