Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

nature.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 358 posts

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#91

Post by vmception »

austincheney wrote: post #47
vmception wrote: post #11

Some detractors often say transgender people have mental health issues. But they mean it in the sense that they should be in an asylum or should not be catered to. A reality is that: A) Gender dysphoria is an imbalance of neural state. Therefore that would by definition be a mental health issue but not like the detractors say. B) Acknowledging and accommodating gender dysphoria discomfort costs cisgender people nothi…

Making the assumption that a mental health issue, perhaps disorder, equates to an illness is a non scientific prejudice.

I agree and understand what you are saying

> equates to an illness

It really seems like we have overlapping and limited words here. I think there isn't a clear distinction between "illness" and "disorder" and this confuses people or isn't helpful in curbing insensitivities.

I think we do have to acknowledge that if we want a safer environment for trans people, a safer environment in the sense that it relies on the mutual cooperation of currently dismissive and insensitive people that aren't willing to cater to people with "mental health issues but not that kind".

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#92

Post by ceejayoz »

School-Cotton wrote: post #70
anchpop wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There isn't one, besides them identifying as genderfluid. Same as any other gender identity (like man or woman). I think this makes the terms slightly less useful but it is very important to some people that they're used this way

It’s not clear to me what this means. I’ve never made any positive choice to be a man. I’ve never told anyone “I’m a man”. But everyone somehow concludes that I’m a man. What does it mean to “identify as” something?

If someone said "you're a woman", would you disagree?

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#93

Post by fock »

valenciarose wrote: post #67
lemonberry wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you heard of Abigail Shrier's book "The Transgender Craze Seducing Our Daughters"? She was on Joe Rogan's podcast recently though I have yet to listen to it. A quick search turned up, not surprisingly, some negative critiques and others that are more positive. If you have heard of it, or read it, I'd love to hear what you think of her position. I appreciate the offer to be part of a dialogue. I think it's import…

It’s not sound and ultimately it’s based in the grief of people who believe they have somehow lost their child (or spouse, or sibling) because they transitioned. I don’t want to minimize the pain of people who have this mindset, no matter how destructive it is. Their sense of loss is genuine and it drives them to the same level of commitment that you see from parents who lose a child to a drunk driver. But, while the…

so could you produce some numbers about transitions? because frankly this discussion (just as the more street-oriented fraction of BLM...) seems driven by a very vocal but ultimately minuscule number of people. And if now in some avantgarde-circles (which never were related to the majority of people and also today generally have their very own orthodoxy... ) trans is en vogue, I doubt that this is the mass phenomenon you think it is.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#94

Post by tjpnz »

austincheney wrote: post #47
vmception wrote: post #11

Some detractors often say transgender people have mental health issues. But they mean it in the sense that they should be in an asylum or should not be catered to. A reality is that: A) Gender dysphoria is an imbalance of neural state. Therefore that would by definition be a mental health issue but not like the detractors say. B) Acknowledging and accommodating gender dysphoria discomfort costs cisgender people nothi…

Making the assumption that a mental health issue, perhaps disorder, equates to an illness is a non scientific prejudice.

Nobody is suggesting that.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#95

Post by leephillips »

dx87 wrote: post #48
8note wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Epidemic implies some kind of disease no? Telling people they're sick for existing is certainly unkindness

No, an epidemic is just anything spreading within a group. > Epidemic: affecting or tending to affect a disproportionately large number of individuals within a population, community, or region at the same time. Edit: You know people can't have an adult conversation on a topic when the definition of a word is downvoted.

Now try to define “woman” and see what happens.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#96

Post by School-Cotton »

ceejayoz wrote: post #92
School-Cotton wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not clear to me what this means. I’ve never made any positive choice to be a man. I’ve never told anyone “I’m a man”. But everyone somehow concludes that I’m a man. What does it mean to “identify as” something?

If someone said "you're a woman", would you disagree?

I think I wouldn’t really care, to be honest. Nobody has ever done that, so I can’t be sure.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#97

Post by ceejayoz »

hh3k0 wrote: post #18
vmception wrote: post #11

Some detractors often say transgender people have mental health issues. But they mean it in the sense that they should be in an asylum or should not be catered to. A reality is that: A) Gender dysphoria is an imbalance of neural state. Therefore that would by definition be a mental health issue but not like the detractors say. B) Acknowledging and accommodating gender dysphoria discomfort costs cisgender people nothi…

> But they mean it in the sense that they should be in an asylum or should not be catered to. I have often heard it in a sense of "should not be catered to but rather given medical help". A fellow student once told me that he considers the current way of treating gender dysphoria irresponsible and that, if we'd treat schizophrenia the way we treat gender dysphoria, we'd all have to aknowledge the voices they hear and…

> if we'd treat schizophrenia the way we treat gender dysphoria, we'd all have to aknowledge the voices they hear and pretend we hear them too

That might not be the worst idea.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/07/when-hear...

> But a new study suggests that the way schizophrenia sufferers experience those voices depends on their cultural context. Surprisingly, schizophrenic people from certain other countries don't hear the same vicious, dark voices that Holt and other Americans do. Some of them, in fact, think their hallucinations are good—and sometimes even magical.

> In an article for the American Scholar, Luhrmann describes one such patient, a 20-year-0ld Dutch man named Hans, whose inner voices were urging him to study Buddhism for hours each day. He cut a deal with his demons, telling them he'd say Buddhist prayers for one hour per day, no more, no less. And it worked—the voices subsided and he was able to taper his dose of psychosis medications.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#98

Post by austincheney »

missedthecue wrote: post #88
austincheney wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making the assumption that a mental health issue, perhaps disorder, equates to an illness is a non scientific prejudice.

Where is the line between "mental health issue" and "mental health illness" if both decrease the patient's quality of life?

An illness is an unhealthy condition, suggestive of treatment if treatment is available. A medical issue is an identifiable subject in the realm of medicine. Most things identifiable are not immediately unhealthy.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#99

Post by empthought »

ceejayoz wrote: post #92
School-Cotton wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not clear to me what this means. I’ve never made any positive choice to be a man. I’ve never told anyone “I’m a man”. But everyone somehow concludes that I’m a man. What does it mean to “identify as” something?

If someone said "you're a woman", would you disagree?

Only on the basis of everyone until that person having said differently, up to and including someone else already having defined “man” as a male human.

Re: Elevated rates of autism in transgender and gender-diverse individuals

#100

Post by ceejayoz »

School-Cotton wrote: post #96
ceejayoz wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone said "you're a woman", would you disagree?

I think I wouldn’t really care, to be honest. Nobody has ever done that, so I can’t be sure.

In that case, perhaps you're one of the people out there who doesn't strongly identify with any particular gender.
Post reply on HN