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Why is there only one Snap Store?

merlijn.sebrechts.be

281–290 of 362 posts

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#281
post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You still need to protect from getting updated by errors or malicious code. For apt you have utilities to edit the keys you don't edit a test file by hand.

Would canonical be interested in accepting such a patch?

No idea, but honestly I would not spend my time on writing such a patch yet , only if I intend to create a great snap store to rival Canonical , otherwise we have enough working alternatives for all use cases that are not about third party binaries that are reviewed by Canonical.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#282
post #219

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That is a real problem, but in my opinion unrelated to whether an OS is "ready for the desktop". That's just a business problem, not a technical problem: Adobe cares about platforms where the money is. It's not a technical problem because people like my mom can learn to use GIMP (note: people who use photo editing software are "pros" of a kind, anyway; "regular" users don't know how to edit photos, either) or Krita o…

Valve has been making amazing in-roads into the Linux gaming sector with Proton.

I'd say gaming is basically there now and it only gets better each year. I often buy games without checking if they are compatible and they run flawlessly.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#283

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> Is flatpack promoting each app will have it's own repo(Skype.Dropbox,Slack,Discord?) Flatpak CAN support the scenario, where each app can have it's own repo. It's an option, not forced down your throat. Or you can self-host your private repo (e.g. applications used inside your network) IN ADDITION to public repos. > Seems to me that you want a way to have applications and updates installed by people and bypass the…

if you are a user then you use a distribution, say Debian,Arch. This distro could setup whatever store, repo and keys they want and Canonical is not forcing themselves on other distributions (it is not systemd). I am looking at this from a dev point of view, you are asking to prioritize a feature that almost nobody will use over other high priority tasks. The article mentions Canonical did this mistake in the past wi…

> This distro could setup whatever store, repo and keys

But only one. And changing it is a matter of replacing binary/entire package. If is a far cry from `flatpak remote-add $url`.

> Canonical is not forcing themselves on other distributions (it is not systemd)

Systemd did not force itself on distribution either. Systemd was solving real problems distributions had, and others were ignoring them. Including Upstart, which only made it worse.

It's not like systemd had easy start. Even Redhat's management didn't see the point (Lennart P. couldn't work on it during his working hours). It took adoption by Arch to change Redhat's position.

> I am looking at this from a dev point of view, you are asking to prioritize a feature that almost nobody will use over other high priority tasks.

How do you know? Did you do any research among users, or it is just against Canonical modus operandi, where they try to insert themselves as gatekeeper in some layer of Linux community and be the single entity that can be approached for a given topic?

For many, it has much higher priority than forced updates, enforcing a single signing key or paid custom stores for FOSS.

> The article mentions

The article does not make honest arguments, it often misdirects. It is an apologia piece.

> Canonical did this mistake in the past with Launchpad and it was for nothing

Canonical did many more, more serious mistakes with Launchpad. Yes, PPAs were a dead-end, but for other reasons, that are for a separate debate.

> The store code seems to be a mess and you can't just drop the code and GitHub and you are done, it is a lot of work to refactor the code.

The code is a mess from the start. Somebody didn't do their homework what their users will be interested in, but only what they are interested in (see gatekeeping above).

> Same for the client, it is a of work to correctly add the feature to support multiple repositories, if it was only 1 day work somebody would have forked the client, patch it and published it already.

On the client we can see that they tried to do MVP, be first on "the market" and capture it. It is full of user visible annoyances that are not going to be solved (polluting mount namespace, visible snap dir in user homedir, no dedup, etc). They did quick and dirty job to be first, instead of doing it properly, like the Flatpak guys did.

> But the reality is that this costs more

So drop the things that make it complicated, such as routing separate stores through Canonical...

The reality is, that this is just an excuse to do what Canonical wants, not what their users want.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To go back to Snap for a second: didn't Linux Mint drop it recently? I'm not happy on Ubuntu with snap because of what seems to be auto-updates -- maybe it's another thing that's auto-updating? I use Hugo [0], whose binaries are still [0] https://gohugo.io

Yes, auto-updates are built into snap. Also, the "solutions" to disable it are pretty much workarounds [1]. All this looks like just what made me stop using windows 10. [1]: https://askubuntu.com/questions/930593/how-to-disable-autore...

The broken updates are what essentially forced me off of windows. Basically I get some awful untested update every 3-4 years that causes a boot loop. Happened in Vista, 7 and 10. The worst part is that the broken update stays in cache and forced updates basically brick your machine every single day until you decide to simply disable the windows update service, delete the windows update folders in hopes that this fixes the problem or reinstall the entire system hoping Microsoft removed the boot loop update.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Example from 2020: Running Ubuntu with two displays each of which has a different scaling factor requires switching to Wayland, because on X11, any window that touches the edge of one of the displays will run unusably slowly. (I don’t know why.) A non-technical “typical desktop user” would never have figured this out. This is on a fully supported Linux machine (XPS 13 9300 Developer Edition).

Well, thats mostly due to Ubuntu still defaulting to X. Fedora switched to Wayland by default back in 2016 and even RHEL 8 (released 2019) defaults to Wayland.

Is there a way to use Wayland in Ubuntu? I run Kubuntu, not sure if that comes with Wayland by default.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#286
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a counter example. Buy a thinkpad and try to put whatever distro you want on it.

Have an X1 Yoga here with Arch on it, it was painless. Bought an X390 for my mom last year, tossed Ubuntu on it after putting in a larger NVMe. (she prefers to use a more 'mainstream' distro so she can follow tutorials to setup new dev environments for things she's tinkering with) Her Macbook Air is weighing down paper now.

The Air is actually a quite good Ubuntu machine, I used it for several years, years ago.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#287

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I appreciate you proving my point. High end desktops are not viable on Linux, which is a shame, because I really wanted it to work.

I give you a variety of points and all I get back is a single flip quip. This is a disappointing rejoinder. You CAN have a high end desktop. You can even have 3-6 monitors if it makes you happy. The only thing you cannot do is plug your monitors into the outputs of both GPUs. You must purchase GPUs wherein a single GPU has sufficient outputs and let the secondary GPU serve to aid in your favorite GPU compute or game…

Is it possible to have two cards and have the second card do computations for the first one to render? I would have thought the time it took to move the data would make that hard.

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#288
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the record Flatpak solves the same issue without mountpoint spam by using OSTree zo store flatpaks and their shared runtimes. Not only that, it gets full deduplication of everything and diff downloads just by using OSTree. AFAIK Snap has no deduplication of installed stuff & not even any dhared runtimes. Not sure if it has diff downloads.

Snap has all of that too.

Must have been added since I last looked into it - got any links with more info about it ? :)

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Graphic performance is excellent if you don't insist on say using Nvidia hardware with the open source Nouveau drivers everyone knows sucks. Open source AMD and closed source Nvidia both provide good performance. Going with just US figures the average spent on a computer in 2020 is 632 usd total. A high end card on the other hand is $400 to $800 each. a 2000-3000 pc with 800-1600 in graphics hardware is probably some…

I appreciate you proving my point. High end desktops are not viable on Linux, which is a shame, because I really wanted it to work.

Dual GPU is a much smaller niche than "high end desktops".

Re: Why is there only one Snap Store?

#290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience aligns far more with parent's than yours. The Linux Desktop experience is still pretty garbage.

Here is an example : take an Intel nuc : Ubuntu, everything works out of box. Win10 ? Let's download a WiFi driver on Intel site ! Let's hope you have Ethernet or a windows 10 supported wifi device. And no, the wifi dongle lying around is too old, windows 7 only... What is your example ?

Bought an Intel NUC, installed Ubuntu, no hardware-accelerated video decoding on Firefox and Chromium needed to be compiled manually with a patch.

This functionality works out of the box on Windows (not that I installed it, as Windows 10 is a dealbreaker to me so I ended up returning the NUC and choosing something else).

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