Earlier quoted context omitted.
It could, but we have a lot of data on those diseases and typically a weakened or reduced dose live virus shot has a known outcome with some outliers where the shot leads to the disease or something worse in the relatively short term. For COVID-19 we are still guessing at most of this, hopefully the long term effects are not too bad and those effects of contracting the disease will get reduced over time. But I would…
I think we're close to agreement, but not quite. We're not, after all, guessing at most . For instance, it's pretty unlikely that COVID-19 will cause you to grow three extra feet from your nose within the next 60 years. There are some things we don't have high certainty on, but our epistemology would be faulty if we ignored how other coronaviruses behave, just like it would be faulty if we ignored how other attenuate…
Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
241–250 of 282 posts
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#242Earlier quoted context omitted.
The difference in worry parents have over short term and "long term" death risks for their kids is marginal. In particular: if something could happen to jeopardize your kids lives while they are still kids --- which we do not know --- it's an overwhelming worry. This is one of those conversations where message board logic stands a good chance of taking us far away from how real-world humans would reason.
I think all it really does is that it highlights the difference between those who have children and those who do not. As a parent, I couldn't care less about the monetary impact of COVID-19 beyond the basics to survive and the years have taught us to be very frugal when we need to be. Meanwhile, the thought of sending my kids back to school in two weeks has me sleepless (again). We have already seen different evidenc…
Did you ever think that some people with kids may not be in the position to work from home and have to go to work every day? I’m sure you’ve seen the statistics where a large percentage of Americans don’t have $400 in savings.
I also bet you have a job that allows you to work from home.
How many households are led by a single parent and/or two parents who have to go to a job where they can’t work from home?
I am not going to sit here tsk tsking all of the people who aren’t as fortunate as I am. Not only do I have a job where I can work from home. We were also in the financial position that we had the option of my wife not going back to work in the school system and just saying it wasn’t worth the risk.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#243Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is precisely zero evidence that a lockdown leads to even a measurable fraction of 1% deaths.
There is zero evidence that a suppression strategy with lockdown will work. And as you said in your other comment the pandemic is not over yet so pulling data from other countries isn't helpful. As to evidence... "One in four young adults between the ages of 18 and 24 say they've considered suicide in the past month because of the pandemic, according to new CDC data that paints a bleak picture of the nation's mental…
As for the suicide factor, yes, there is a chance of increased numbers of suicides, no for now there is no proof that such an increase is actually happening. If previous pandemics - without a lockdown - are any guide then a pandemic has regardless of the measures taken an increased risk of people committing suicide.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#244Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are they? Nobody seems to care much about the ordinary flu, though lots still die from it. Hospital acquired infections are a major cause of death, but few worry about that. The most likely causes of death for children are drowning and car accidents, but people worry far more about terrorist incidents. And on it goes.
Do you believe that the flu poses a more significant risk than COVID-19, despite being both more contagious and more deadly?
I'm well aware of the flu risk, and already had my vaccination for that for this season. Most people I know poo-poo getting that vaccination, despite it taking only 5 minutes and is already paid for by one's insurance.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#245Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Their ability to spread to adults is their biggest risk factor, not the disease itself. Even if this is true (we already have evidence it's not for some children), it's completely irresponsible to allow schools to open. We know children are infectious and easily spread the disease. There are other members of society besides children. Letting the virus run rampant in schools will lead to parents and other adults get…
there's other forces at work with the rush to open schools than just covid19. Keep in mind, extended unemployment is expiring as well as a number of other emergency programs. School is the only place where many kids get a semi-square meal regularly. For many kids it's also a much safer environment than not school.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#246Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think all it really does is that it highlights the difference between those who have children and those who do not. As a parent, I couldn't care less about the monetary impact of COVID-19 beyond the basics to survive and the years have taught us to be very frugal when we need to be. Meanwhile, the thought of sending my kids back to school in two weeks has me sleepless (again). We have already seen different evidenc…
As a parent, I couldn't care less about the monetary impact of COVID-19 beyond the basics to survive and the years have taught us to be very frugal when we need to be. Did you ever think that some people with kids may not be in the position to work from home and have to go to work every day? I’m sure you’ve seen the statistics where a large percentage of Americans don’t have $400 in savings. I also bet you have a job…
Yes, did you read the whole comment thread before asking that question? Because I specifically addressed it in another comment hours ago.
> I’m sure you’ve seen the statistics where a large percentage of Americans don’t have $400 in savings.
Yes, and as I've often said in other places and here as well: America is a country that has serious problems in terms of how the wealth is distributed. But that problem was there before COVID, and COVID is only going to make that problem worse. It is a systemic issue that won't be solved by how we deal with the virus and the associated disease.
Just like the 'war on drugs' impacts people from different social strata disproportionally, the same with three strikes laws and lots of other problems like that. It is a direct result of the laws you make and the politicians you vote for.
> I also bet you have a job that allows you to work from home.
That bet would work out, today. But six months ago that wasn't the case and as a result of that I contracted the virus at the end of the last job abroad and spent three weeks in bed. Fortunately I made it through and have decided that if I can't do my work remotely then I won't do my work.
> How many households are led by a single parent and/or two parents who have to go to a job where they can’t work from home?
Many. So, society should foot the bill there. It's only logical. This is how it is done in other countries.
> I am not going to sit here tsk tsking all of the people who aren’t as fortunate as I am.
Neither am I.
> Not only do I have a job where I can work from home. We were also in the financial position that we had the option of my wife not going back to work in the school system and just saying it wasn’t worth the risk.
Lucky you. But that is just you. For every you there are multiple people for who that is not the case. What are you going to do about that? Are you willing to pay increased taxes for a social safety net?
America is one giant study in the tragedy of the commons. And COVID just brings that out, it did not create any of it.
Take Lithuania or Latvia. Countries that suffered from being USSR satelite states for decades. Within a relatively short while their political structure and other infra put them on a footing solid enough to deal with this situation as it should be done, and many Western countries should look to them as examples of how you tackle a problem like this.
For those countries where it is worse - sometimes much worse - and which are substantially richer than Latvia and Lithuania you should be asking yourself what went wrong and why.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#247There is a massive, silent demographic who wants a return to status quo. There was a conference call with the school district the other night. A friend in the district was in awe at how many parents want their children to return to school, are upset about sports, etc. Many people want to look at this as a black and white issue - either you believe social distancing and masks are necessary, or you believe that Bill Ga…
:s/believe/know
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#248Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Whereas with the pandemic we seemingly are just accepting high death rates Except the death rates are very low. The risk due to lockdown are greater than this virus.
The thing is, a lock down isn't required to stop the virus.
Re: Parents are 5X as Worried about Infection and School than Work and Paying Bills
#249Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is zero evidence that a suppression strategy with lockdown will work. And as you said in your other comment the pandemic is not over yet so pulling data from other countries isn't helpful. As to evidence... "One in four young adults between the ages of 18 and 24 say they've considered suicide in the past month because of the pandemic, according to new CDC data that paints a bleak picture of the nation's mental…
Why is everybody going on about 'the lockdown'. There is exactly one city in the world that had a complete lockdown, that's Wuhan, China. Every other place had at best a partial lockdown with a ton of exemptions and a large amount of leeway for emergencies and other edge cases. As for the suicide factor, yes, there is a chance of increased numbers of suicides, no for now there is no proof that such an increase is act…