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Epic direct payment on mobile

epicgames.com

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Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#201

Post by gilrain »

013a wrote: post #122
sawaruna wrote: post #70

>Does a new payment method on mobile mean purchases there are less safe? >No. Thousands of apps on the App Store approved by Apple accept direct payments, including commonly used apps like Amazon, Grubhub, Nike SNKRS, Best Buy, DoorDash, Fandango, McDonalds, Uber, Lyft, and StubHub. We think all developers should be free to support direct payments in all apps. [0] All of these services provide something physical. You…

> Does this mean Epic will start allowing users of the Epic Games Store on PC to directly pay game developers and bypass the EGS cut? If you follow Tim Sweeney and Epic's history surrounding "app store cuts", you'd know that they've always stood on the side of developers. The EGS stands among the lowest app store cuts of any marketplace, at 12%, and Tim has become visibly angry during public appearances concerning Ap…

"Is what's good for the (Apple) goose good for the (Epic Games Store) gander?"

"No, but we'll screw you for less than Steam."

12% may be less than 30%, but it's still the same business practice that they're decrying when it's applied to them. That's hypocrisy.

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#202

Post by Hokusai »

closeparen wrote: post #162
Hokusai wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm thinking of the dodgier companies. Right now I have little to worry about when I leave my kid playing a game, all the payment need to go through Apple or at least the offending app will not stay up for too long. Nothing stops dodgier companies to ask your kid a credit card number. If you trust an app and it charges you in a dodgy way, you can claim that charge with your credit company. On-line transactions work…

The App Store review process stops it. To dispute charges that were indeed made by a member of your household, you usually have to file a police report against them. The method of paying for things online by shared secret numbers is insane. Phones permit much more reasonable payments architectures, since they can sign transactions with their TPMs instead of spraying your credit card number everywhere. We should see p…

> We should see phones replace credit card entry even for transactions started on desktops.

The two banks I use already have this, as many other banks. I already have to trust my bank, they literally have my money. I pay my taxes and sign them thru my bank, I do transfers, I pay subscriptions, etc. everything with my bank signature.

Apple is what is stopping more apps to use my bank signature to pay directly thru it. Apple is stopping more secure banking to able to take a piece of the cake.

> The App Store review process stops it.

No, that is not how apple review process works. Many content is server-side. Pop-ups are send from the server to your game/app. Games and app have browsers that can render anything and communicate anywhere.

The App review process may catch some obvious things, but it cannot know what an app connected to the internet is going to do.

Even malware, that should be way easier to detect and stop , way easier than to stop a pop-up asking for your credit card, pass thru their system: https://www.wandera.com/ios-trojan-malware/

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#203

Post by dogma1138 »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #110
gutnor wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm scared of that though. Although on one end I would like to buy my kindle books straight from the app and play xcloud games, I'm thinking of the dodgier companies. Right now I have little to worry about when I leave my kid playing a game, all the payment need to go through Apple or at least the offending app will not stay up for too long. I want Apple to be forced to come up with a fairer solution (eg: same api, b…

All Apple has to do to fix this is allow sideloading. They don't need to change the App Store's rules—they can make them more stringent, actually—and you can set up your child's phone to block non-App-Store installations. Heck, Epic would probably cave and accept the cost to keep Fortnite in the App Store; they tried to go around Google Play, and it seemingly didn't work out.

The main reason I use an iPhone is that it doesn’t allow side loading out side of development applications and has a curated closed store.

I want an ecosystem that works and I can rely on including knowing that little to no one can side load a malicious application onto the device.

I’m also very well aware of the fact that while Apple scalps developers it’s also the reason why my devices get security updates for 6 years while Google can’t provide updates after 2.

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#204

Post by gilrain »

PavleMiha wrote: post #114
sawaruna wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm asking if they will allow people to buy digital PC titles on EGS via direct purchase to the developer and bypass the percentage EGS takes. People are bringing up digital currency or IAP, but if Epic is arguing for 'direct payments in all apps', why would this be limited solely to digital currency and not the digital item itself?

Because then Apple would have to implement alternative payment methods into the App Store, which seems unreasonable. They're arguing that inside the app it's the developer's responsibility to handle payments however they see fit.

The point is that they're not applying that argument to their own storefront.

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#205

Post by rsweeney21 »

Epic is declaring war on app store fees and other monopolistic app store practices. Tim Sweeney (no relation) has been a very vocal opponent of the app store practices of Apple and Google. He views them as monopolistic and anti-competitive.

https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/128961139770219724...

https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/128922755043103129...

https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/128852123070273945...

My inside sources tell me that this move is intended to start a legal battle with Apple and Google.

I really love Epic.

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#207

Post by dogma1138 »

celticninja wrote: post #175
alexeldeib wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the original article, this also sidesteps google play.

I don't think that Google has the same requirements as apple, vis a vis, all payments need to go through apple app store, which includes subscriptions or coin purchases.

They do, the only difference is that unlike Apple Google just takes the money and gives the users nothing in return.

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#208

Post by Fargren »

dogma1138 wrote: post #203
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All Apple has to do to fix this is allow sideloading. They don't need to change the App Store's rules—they can make them more stringent, actually—and you can set up your child's phone to block non-App-Store installations. Heck, Epic would probably cave and accept the cost to keep Fortnite in the App Store; they tried to go around Google Play, and it seemingly didn't work out.

The main reason I use an iPhone is that it doesn’t allow side loading out side of development applications and has a curated closed store. I want an ecosystem that works and I can rely on including knowing that little to no one can side load a malicious application onto the device. I’m also very well aware of the fact that while Apple scalps developers it’s also the reason why my devices get security updates for 6 ye…

> I want an ecosystem that works and I can rely on including knowing that little to no one can side load a malicious application onto the device.

I don't understand this, can you explain why? As long as you don't sideload on your own phone, why would having the option be a problem?

Re: Epic direct payment on mobile

#210

Post by Wowfunhappy »

dogma1138 wrote: post #203
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All Apple has to do to fix this is allow sideloading. They don't need to change the App Store's rules—they can make them more stringent, actually—and you can set up your child's phone to block non-App-Store installations. Heck, Epic would probably cave and accept the cost to keep Fortnite in the App Store; they tried to go around Google Play, and it seemingly didn't work out.

The main reason I use an iPhone is that it doesn’t allow side loading out side of development applications and has a curated closed store. I want an ecosystem that works and I can rely on including knowing that little to no one can side load a malicious application onto the device. I’m also very well aware of the fact that while Apple scalps developers it’s also the reason why my devices get security updates for 6 ye…

They can, if they exploit an iOS vulnerability, as has been done many times in the past. Is this so different from using vulnerabilities to bypass a permission prompt?
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