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Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

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Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#101
post #78

I've never understood why media companies don't treat ad sales as a core business. They are in the business of delivering ads to eyeballs, so why are they outsourcing their core business. I can see outsourcing the ad platform. However sales should be in house, and they should exercise editorial control over who is allowed to advertise.

I can see the cost of sales being quite high.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#102
post #13
post #4

It's refreshing to see an assumption of incompetence rather than malice, since I seem to have come across the idea that Google is questionably motivated by ideology rather a lot recently. One thing I don't understand is why Google continues to try to use algorithmic solutions for content moderation. Surely the frequent false positives ends up hurting potential revenue? And would it not be able to hire people to at le…

After incompetence and malice, there’s a third option, or maybe a blend of two: arrogance and laziness. They’ve been sitting on top of the world for a while. The results sometimes speak for themselves. As a case in point, for over a full decade they have been flagging their own emails, that they send, that they know I signed up for, as spam. For a decade. Possibly as long as two decades.

Can’t edit. Not two decades, but ever since gmail added spam filtering and started flagging many Google Alert emails as spam.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#103
post #4

It's refreshing to see an assumption of incompetence rather than malice, since I seem to have come across the idea that Google is questionably motivated by ideology rather a lot recently. One thing I don't understand is why Google continues to try to use algorithmic solutions for content moderation. Surely the frequent false positives ends up hurting potential revenue? And would it not be able to hire people to at le…

>It seems one could even argue that Google's focus on algorithmic rather than human solutions is a kind of harmful ideology It's the kind of ideology that you often find in people who think they are smarter than everyone else.

That seems a bit ironic of an accusation given all of the people who don't do even back of the envelope math about what their demands for scaling would cost to try to do manually. Isn't that like saying plumbers are arrogantly obsessed with imprisoning water using pipes instead of free flowing streams of water while not considering the evaporation and contamination of said approach?

Scalability of algorithims is how they became a behemoth in the first place. I would call it being ruthlessly un-ideological in a sense. While there are implicit goals the approach is more "whatever works" for the system as a whole. While annoying it isn't a breaking point that gets people to exodus.

It is ultimatelty "democratic" in being what is wanted instead of what makes sense. Like the yotube advertiser exoduses where they stupidly think they need "advertiser friendly" content or it will harm their brand when nobody gives a fuck that they advertise on content where people swear or talk about sex.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#104
Google's true customers are the people buying ads in the first place. They could care less about publishers.

Banning one publisher (unless it's truly massive), isn't going to have much effect to Google's bottom line, so they err on the side of protecting the 'quality' of places ads can be served, at all costs. This also comes through when you see 'invalid traffic' deductions on your AdSense income reports, as i'm sure almost every account running AdSense does, along with the seemingly random crawler errors mentioned in the article. They don't feel the need to explain themselves, and can withhold the revenue at the excuse of 'protecting' the advertiser's side of things.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#105

I think the more correct answer to "Why Are Currently No Ads on Techdirt?" is "Because we put all of our eggs in one basket." Don't build a single point of failure into your revenue stream. There are plenty of alternatives to Google that they should have been using in a smaller way that they could then move into prime position. That way, Techdirt's revenue might have been diminished, but not eliminated.

I want to medium-to-heavy push back on this. Techdirt didn't build a single point of failure into their revenue stream, otherwise the title of this article would be, "Why is Techdirt closing down?". Their support page[0] lists 8 different revenue sources other than Google Ads. And this is precisely the type of diversity that you want. Signing up for 5 different ad networks isn't really good diversity, because: A) you…

You don't add a second ad network to widen your revenue stream just like you don't have a backup ISP to double your bandwidth. You do it so that when you have a (temporary) outage with one you can quickly switch to the other and not lose operations. There are some classes of outages that might affect both ad-streams, but there are other classes (like account status issues) that are completely independent.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#106
post #80
post #4

It's refreshing to see an assumption of incompetence rather than malice, since I seem to have come across the idea that Google is questionably motivated by ideology rather a lot recently. One thing I don't understand is why Google continues to try to use algorithmic solutions for content moderation. Surely the frequent false positives ends up hurting potential revenue? And would it not be able to hire people to at le…

> One thing I don't understand is why Google continues to try to use algorithmic solutions for content moderation. I don't mean to sound condescending, but I think the answer to this question would be much clearer to you if you took a moment to try to comprehend the scale that google operates in.

Some random source on the internet tells me Alphabet made around 7 billion profit in a quarter last year. That's 28 billion per year. At 100k/year per person you get 280 000 people doing moderation for you to breakeven. According to another random source Alphabet has about 120k employees.

The scale is not the problem, the profiteering is.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#107

Google's true customers are the people buying ads in the first place. They could care less about publishers. Banning one publisher (unless it's truly massive), isn't going to have much effect to Google's bottom line, so they err on the side of protecting the 'quality' of places ads can be served, at all costs. This also comes through when you see 'invalid traffic' deductions on your AdSense income reports, as i'm sur…

Also, I'd love to see ad serving go back to direct sold simple images and links, with no tracking or programmatic targeting involved at all. Obviously for 99% of websites this is impossible, but it'd be more equitable long term.

I often wonder how the web would have evolved differently if early in the HTML spec an html tag was added that just had a SRC and href attribute.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#108
post #13
post #4

It's refreshing to see an assumption of incompetence rather than malice, since I seem to have come across the idea that Google is questionably motivated by ideology rather a lot recently. One thing I don't understand is why Google continues to try to use algorithmic solutions for content moderation. Surely the frequent false positives ends up hurting potential revenue? And would it not be able to hire people to at le…

After incompetence and malice, there’s a third option, or maybe a blend of two: arrogance and laziness. They’ve been sitting on top of the world for a while. The results sometimes speak for themselves. As a case in point, for over a full decade they have been flagging their own emails, that they send, that they know I signed up for, as spam. For a decade. Possibly as long as two decades.

You could interpret that in a positive way, that they're not just papering over problems in their filter by privileging their own messages.

Not super positive but still.

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#109

A few months ago, I tried experimenting with Google ads to drive some traffic to a side project of mine which was basically a chess-over-videochat website. A little more than 40 impressions later, it was taken down for being "in violation of our Google ad policies". There was never any indication what the violation actually was. I replied and asked several times hoping to get a human to tell me what I had actually do…

this is exactly my experience, after making 1$, Google blocked my AdMob account, I tried to communicate issue and sent multiple emails, tried to convince them I am not doing anything harmful, without any luck.

after one year I wanted to integrate Google ads into another my side project and my account was still blocked (I took down my first application and re-applied again without any success)

Re: Why are currently no ads on Techdirt? apparently Google thinks we're dangerous

#110
post #78

I've never understood why media companies don't treat ad sales as a core business. They are in the business of delivering ads to eyeballs, so why are they outsourcing their core business. I can see outsourcing the ad platform. However sales should be in house, and they should exercise editorial control over who is allowed to advertise.

Most medium to large media companies do have their own sales staff for online advertising! The problem generally is that they can't sell enough local/direct-sold ads at a high enough CPM to sell out their inventory. This is where they use something like AdSense, to fill in those gaps where they couldn't sell anything for a higher rate.
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