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Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

politico.eu

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Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#111

Post by Krisando »

eckesicle wrote: post #81
Krisando wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They'll get Amazon to cave. I'm not so sure, and I'll explain why below on one of your points. > in the end garbage collectors will refuse to pick up garbage at their warehouse. Electricians will refuse to service their warehouse. Plumbers will not plumb. Workers, builders, postmen etc will all simply stop servicing Amazon. Companies that deal with Amazon can also be put in a blockade. Outside of employing builders…

You absolutely have a point but I also think that you perhaps don't have the social or historical context to understand how deeply rooted unions are in Swedish society. The Toysrus strike has been mentioned and at the time the unions did not even use all means at their disposal. In the event of a general strike bus drivers could well refuse to stop at bus stops servicing the warehouse. Banks will refuse to process tr…

That's really interesting; also, one of my Swedish friends learned something new, he wasn't aware of that before either.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#112

Post by tomduncalf »

wasmitnetzen wrote: post #67
ornornor wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren’t amazon reviews one of the most gamed review system ever? Also, stock co-mingling. That alone makes me buy as little from amazon and as much from elsewhere as I can.

I feel like to stock co-mingling issue is far less pronounced in Europe compared to what the American crowd here on HN says. I live in Europe, and never got a fake product from Amazon.

Just as another data point, same here in the UK and i buy quite a lot of things from there

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#113

Post by Bayart »

ornornor wrote: post #58
redgc wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always attempt to shop from Amazon Germany because (a) larger variety of items, and (b) I feel I can trust the reviews there. Have you found Swedish e-commerce sites to have enough reliable reviews to buy anything with confidence, or do you tend to buy products that you can find reviews of elsewhere? I joke to my wife, "If 500 Germans say it's good, I'm sold"

Aren’t amazon reviews one of the most gamed review system ever? Also, stock co-mingling. That alone makes me buy as little from amazon and as much from elsewhere as I can.

It's less of an issue on the EU side of Amazon. The search engine being cluttered by Chinese shit is just as bad, though.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#114

Post by spindle »

bildung wrote: post #59
spindle wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you suggest something specific to read please? Thank you.

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/03/18/sweden-retail-union... TL;DR: refusal to sign a collective agreement escalated into an all-out boycott of the company. In the end, the workers won. "Toys “R” Us was both an exception to the rule —even McDonald's was forced to sign a collective agreement — and a warning for other corporations that they must adapt to the Swedish model or fail"

Thank you!

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#115

Post by mongol »

eckesicle wrote: post #81
Krisando wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They'll get Amazon to cave. I'm not so sure, and I'll explain why below on one of your points. > in the end garbage collectors will refuse to pick up garbage at their warehouse. Electricians will refuse to service their warehouse. Plumbers will not plumb. Workers, builders, postmen etc will all simply stop servicing Amazon. Companies that deal with Amazon can also be put in a blockade. Outside of employing builders…

You absolutely have a point but I also think that you perhaps don't have the social or historical context to understand how deeply rooted unions are in Swedish society. The Toysrus strike has been mentioned and at the time the unions did not even use all means at their disposal. In the event of a general strike bus drivers could well refuse to stop at bus stops servicing the warehouse. Banks will refuse to process tr…

Did banks really refuse to process their transactions? That is union overreach I would say.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#116

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

If the quality of item descriptions is anything like Amazon.DE's right now, maybe other Swedish online retailers don't need to worry too much. It's already possible for me to buy from Amazon in Sweden (Amazon.DE ships to Sweden, using PostNord no less), but the listings are poor quality and you can't trust it. I only use it as a last resort. (Mind you, I also avoid Amazon because I don't like their business practices.)

It should also be mentioned that e-commerce is easier in Sweden than in some other countries. The ubiquity of electronic ID, the national address database and rapid bank transfers mean that even if you do not use PayPal, creating an account and ordering with a new website is very quick and requires entering almost no personal details yourself. Many websites even let you pay by invoice.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#117

Post by kevinak »

Yetanfou wrote: post #99
kalleboo wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I lived in Sweden I was a religious user of prisjakt.nu and thought the reviews there were decent

Yup, that's what I'm using as well, usually in combination with a check on ebay.de and ebay.co.uk for products which fit the bill - i.e. not for heavy, bulky goods like fridges and washing machines but certainly for smaller electronics and tools. For larger computer hardware - servers etc - I tend to look towards Germany and the UK since prices tend to be quite a bit lower than here in Sweden. I have only bought some…

I don't think your point about the handling fee rings very true. If you followed the news at the time when it was added you would know that it was put in place to counter the huge workload that came with handling all the packages from cheap Chinese online stores (like Wish). Before that PostNord almost never charged for handling packages from outside the EU. The same can not be said about DHL, UPS and Fedex who ALWAYS make sure to charge extra for handling any package from outside the EU, almost without fail.

It makes sense in my mind that the buyer should be the one to pay for the handling of what they buy. I don't want to subsidise your shopping/shipping via my taxes, they're high enough as it is.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#118

Post by Yetanfou »

kevinak wrote: post #117
Yetanfou wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, that's what I'm using as well, usually in combination with a check on ebay.de and ebay.co.uk for products which fit the bill - i.e. not for heavy, bulky goods like fridges and washing machines but certainly for smaller electronics and tools. For larger computer hardware - servers etc - I tend to look towards Germany and the UK since prices tend to be quite a bit lower than here in Sweden. I have only bought some…

I don't think your point about the handling fee rings very true. If you followed the news at the time when it was added you would know that it was put in place to counter the huge workload that came with handling all the packages from cheap Chinese online stores (like Wish). Before that PostNord almost never charged for handling packages from outside the EU. The same can not be said about DHL, UPS and Fedex who ALWAY…

Postnord's argument that the handling of parcels from China took too much time was utterly nonsensical, especially given in the light of their usual complaints about the fact that fewer people were mailing stuff so they had to raise prices. If handling parcels from China took too much time they simply had not been very good in negotiating a deal with China Post about parcel rates.

Another factor in the nonsensicality of this tariff is that Sweden is more or less the only country which starts charging sales tax (called moms here, comparable with VAT in the UK, BTW in the Netherlands etc.) from a value of 0kr (i.e. free, but sales tax is paid on the shipping costs). Where other European countries start charging sales tax when the value of imported goods rises above (e.g.) €20, Sweden starts at €0. Many parcels ordered from China fall under that rate which make it a very common thing to be represented with the following:

   price of ordered goods including shipping: €4
   sales tax: €1
   "handling fee": €8
   total: €13, of which €9 goes to the Swedish state (directly or through Postnord)
Mind, this is not the shipping fee as that was already paid for in the €4 purchase price. If the same parcel were ordered to the Netherlands the customer would pay €4 and that's it, no import fees and no tariffs.

The so-called "handling fee" is nothing but an excuse to put a tariff on international trade for individuals, a way to make sure the fruits of globalisation stay out of reach of the public.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#119

Post by shajznnckfke »

Semaphor wrote: post #79
AnssiH wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m not sure we have co-mingling here We do, the seller setting for that ("Barcode preference") is there in the Seller Central Europe and the help text explicitly talks about commingling.

Thanks. Do you know why the counterfeit problem does not seem as much of a problem here?

I think HN commenters also overstate the problem. I’m in the US, use Amazon a lot, and haven’t noticed counterfeits. Maybe I’m just bad at identifying them.

I think it’s the type of issue where it would be a major problem for the producer of a specific product that got ripped off, and any customers who are fans of that product, but may never affect the average buyer.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#120

Post by savanaly »

Semaphor wrote: post #79
AnssiH wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m not sure we have co-mingling here We do, the seller setting for that ("Barcode preference") is there in the Seller Central Europe and the help text explicitly talks about commingling.

Thanks. Do you know why the counterfeit problem does not seem as much of a problem here?

I live in the US and out of hundreds (thousands?) of purchases only one or two have made me question if they were counterfeit, and even those worked well enough and I didn't return them. There may be a selection bias in the comments you read because the countless people like me never post their experience and the 0.001% who unluckily were repeatedly sold counterfeit will likely post about it.
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