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Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

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Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#121
post #83

> "What worker doesn't want to have access to paid sick leave?" Becerra said. "What worker doesn't want to have unemployment insurance at a time of Covid-19 crisis? What worker doesn't want to know that they'll get paid for overtime if they work 60 hours in a week or 12 hours in a day?" Since when are we reasoning about workers starting from what they want? If we go by that reasoning, "What worker does not want to be…

Change want to deserve and I think you'll get the idea.

A service that can only exist if workers are denied basics probably shouldn't exist.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#122
post #92
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I applaud the CEO for this decision. It forces at least a glimpse of understanding on the local voters that one cannot combine ideological utopia and a functional economy.

It'll force local municipalities to take care of their transportation needs directly instead of outsourcing it to disloyal mercenaries. The cities that will be hurt are the ones that over relied on a parasitic business instead of investing in essential infrastructure.

What is parasitic about it? That they are using public roads?

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#123

I don't know what kind of background checks and interviewing (if any) Uber drivers have to currently go through (beyond having a valid driver's license and good driving history?), but if I'm hiring someone as a full time employee, you better believe I'm going to be more rigorous and it will cost me more, and that will limit the number of available Uber drivers IMO, or the number Uber will allow to work for 40+ hours.…

> If a driver chooses to Uber as their primary (or sole) source of income, that's their choice.

Government partially exists to protect people against themselves.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#124

Seems like a fair outcome to me. If they can't operate within the law, they shouldn't operate.

I'm conflicted about this because i believe drivers deserve benefits but also uber should not be forced to pay full benefits for someone who drives just a bit on a weekend night. Where is the line of hours driven until you get benefits? I dont know, but I think that is the wrong question. The right question is -- why is this forced onto Uber rather than being a question of national healthcare. If we offered national…

> ...forced to pay full benefits for someone who drives just a bit on a weekend night.

And for their competitor.

Dara Khosrowshahi is right that there needs to be a "third way." Uber would obviously prefer contractors, and maybe the "third way" talk is just them realizing that's not politically viable, but however they reached the conclusion, they're right that this is a different category of work.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#125
post #17
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Uber hasn't been preparing internally for the possibility of losing this suit, they've been irresponsible in the hopes that California would go "oh shit, they're gonna shoot the hostage".

Well, I'm sure they have. They fundamentally disagree with the outcome, and so they will just not operate in California. Nobody will because the business model won't allow you to pay people enough money without charging too much. I also fundamentally agree with Uber and others here. They created a platform for someone to make a few bucks. If I sell something on Etsy they don't have to all of a sudden pay for my healt…

If I sell something on Etsy they don't have to all of a sudden pay for my healthcare costs.

Etsy is not even remotely the same thing as Uber. For starters, shops choose what they want to sell, and for how much, and customers choose which shops on Etsy they wish to buy from. Other than handling payment processing, Etsy operates just like a mall.

In contrast, riders don't get to choose which driver they get; Uber chooses for them. Uber chooses how much riders pay and how much of that drivers get. Uber is not a platform, it's just a techified transportation service.

Many people depend on rideshare like Uber to get to work like a public utility.

This is an extremely warped and privileged view to have. Only people with lots of discretionary income used Uber to commute to work before COVID. They did not depend on it. And this is a very small subset of the US or CA populations; most people can't afford to take an Uber to work everyday.

I really wish people would stop giving government a pass and wanting corporations to come save them.

The problem is corporations like Uber that are exploiting their employees, not government. Corporations started paying their executives tens of millions for minimal work instead of the labor force doing the work and actually creating the value.

Maybe if California (and this is true of other areas) actually built and invested in bike able neighborhoods and public transport, then they wouldn't need Uber.

California, including especially the Bay Area, LA, and San Diego, has public transportation, and thousands of miles of bike lanes. It is possible to visit every major city and national park in CA using just public transportation.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#126
post #94

Just make the whole service distributed. Cut out Uber. Connect me directly to a driver through open source software. Person A exists who is willing to drive from point a to point b for x price. I am willing to pay x price. An open source software exists to connect us both in real time. Who will the government regulate in this scenario?

If this existed, there would be a much stronger case for the drivers being independent contractors. Uber employees are employees specifically because Uber dictates most aspects surrounding their work outside of their hours.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#127

Could this be posturing to get the state to back down on the enforcement of its decision? And does anyone have a guess if Uber is making money in California right now? Given the state is still in lock down.

it is. Airbnb tried to pull the same trick in New York City. All Uber has to do is follow the law. Of course they can't since their business model is based on violating labour laws. If your business model relies on doing something illegal to make money then you are no better than the mafia, it's just organized crime. As for people here who invoke "freedom of work". Most people doing these jobs don't have much choice…

Legality can't be used to derive ethics. Slavery and prohibition were all legal in the past, but I don't think they're ethical.

In the same way, I consider unethical removing people's freedom to work in the way they voluntarily choose.

Sure, this is what we have now and not following the law, hoping to change things (aka disrupting the taxi lobbies) is a business risk , but I still hope for a society in which people are free to decide how they work.

I wouldn't compare them to mobsters that use violence. Uber may not have a stellar reputation, but it's not forcing anyone to work. It's the government which actually resembles a giant mafia gang, imposing rules and asking 99% of the population for money (taxes, or just call it pizzo) on threat of imprisonment - while letting their rich friends avoid them.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#128
post #83

> "What worker doesn't want to have access to paid sick leave?" Becerra said. "What worker doesn't want to have unemployment insurance at a time of Covid-19 crisis? What worker doesn't want to know that they'll get paid for overtime if they work 60 hours in a week or 12 hours in a day?" Since when are we reasoning about workers starting from what they want? If we go by that reasoning, "What worker does not want to be…

> Increase the costs of running the service, and you don't have work anymore.

And suddenly a competitor that gives it’s employees regular benefits is viable! The magic of a regulated free market.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is, of course, something Uber's done several times before. It's hardly cynical.

I lived through this in Austin. It's happening again.

Doesn't Austin have a local rideshare service that's popular? I thought I remembered them filling the void created when Uber left.

Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California

#130
post #91
post #43

Maybe I'm cynical but "temporarily shut down" sounds like a formula to: - Inconvenience a certain class of urbanites who have grown accustomed to being driven around in the hopes that they - Complain loudly to their representatives and other governmental officials in the hope that - The state will reverse this judgement

Uber isn't the only company who provides this commodity. If Lyft continues to operate, that certain class of urbanites will switch to Lyft before they complain to their reps.

Lyft certainly has the option to comply with the law and jack up their prices to compensate. There are probably fewer "frivolous" reasons to use ride-sharing at the moment anyway and a decent percentage of that class of urbanites aren't all that price sensitive.
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