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Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

politico.eu

31–40 of 149 posts

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#31
post #7

What a weird article. Loads of international companies operate in countries with wildly different laws, standards of living, disposable income, etc. Why compare Sweden with a Polish warehouse workers and not investigate how e.g. Amazon.fr operates? That country at least goes on strike significantly more often (probably more so than the rest of the EU combined). Meaning, one year I noticed them on strike every other w…

I don't know if you've quite understood how Swedish labor law differs from the French.

Sweden is a little unique in that we have fewer strikes than most European countries. The reason is the "fredsplikt": as long as there is a collective bargaining agreement in place, if a worker goes on strike they can be legally laid off for shirking work.

So, strikes will only happen at most every two-three years when the current agreement expires. And while then there may be a threat of strike, it seldom comes to that.

In contrast, in most contries (notably France), unions may do "political strikes" to express opinions.

Amazon won't be worried about their Swedish employees unpredictably going on strike for better terms. They will be worrying about having to agree to the same collective agreement as competing businesses. They will not get to push salaries lower than others, or squeeze slightly more hours or shorter breaks. So, they will have to look forward to their profits coming from economy of scale and not mistreatment of their warehouse workers. They will not be able to keep prices 10% lower than competitors while keeping the same profit margin, the way they do in the U.S.

Until they sign an agreement, workers at other companies will likely put them under blockade, which means truckers from suppliers will refuse to ship to Amazon's Swedish warehouse; Postal workers will not pick up shipments to consumers; Caterers and conference centres won't service management meetings; Electricians will not service their warehouse; Garbage will not get picked up, etc. They can do some of this themselves, instead, but that's a very high threshold to cross on day 1.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#32

Amazon is the kind of company to instead build high speed hovercraft and base them in Poland or park a large warehouse offshore.

They also need to account for safety of goods and stability of their assets and operations. So they will need stable political climate to operate.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#33
post #16
post #11

I live in Stockholm, and order regularly from Amazon Germany already. It's free shipping if you order 39 euro or above, which usually delivers things in around a week. Fast shipping of two working days costs 9 euro per shipment. Based on what I've read and this article, it doesn't sound like that much will change once it officially "launches" a Swedish site, although maybe Amazon will lower the minimum amount for fre…

Something I forgot to add: Sweden does have some great gig worker to-the-door delivery companies that have sprung up, particularly around small items like from online pharmacies. When you fulfill an order using those companies they typically have a great monitoring app to track where your delivery is, to input your building door code if necessary, inform you when it's been left outside your door, etc. I always find i…

Germany has interesting approach for this: if you can't be reached, the delivery will be left to whichever neighbour or coffee shop happens to accept it. You'll get notified where it was left, and then just go knocking.

It's quite weird at first but in my experience works surprisingly well. Very rarely one has to go queue in the post office to collect the parcel.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#34
post #19

I'm very interested to see how Amazon's entry into the Swedish market plays out. I used to shop a lot on Amazon back when I lived in the SF Bay Area and thought I would miss it when I moved to Stockholm but honestly that has not been the case. I get 1-2 day shipping from other online retailers in Sweden anyway (like CDON and Webhallen) and there is quite fierce competition between a few of the bigger names in the gam…

I always attempt to shop from Amazon Germany because (a) larger variety of items, and (b) I feel I can trust the reviews there. Have you found Swedish e-commerce sites to have enough reliable reviews to buy anything with confidence, or do you tend to buy products that you can find reviews of elsewhere? I joke to my wife, "If 500 Germans say it's good, I'm sold"

As a German, don't trust the reviews, they're heavily manipulated. I guess at some point (e.g. top seller with thousands of reviews) manipulation doesn't move the needle as much, but for plenty of products with < 100 reviews, there's often dozens that are likely fakes (even without counting the paid Vine reviews).

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#35
post #19

I'm very interested to see how Amazon's entry into the Swedish market plays out. I used to shop a lot on Amazon back when I lived in the SF Bay Area and thought I would miss it when I moved to Stockholm but honestly that has not been the case. I get 1-2 day shipping from other online retailers in Sweden anyway (like CDON and Webhallen) and there is quite fierce competition between a few of the bigger names in the gam…

I always attempt to shop from Amazon Germany because (a) larger variety of items, and (b) I feel I can trust the reviews there. Have you found Swedish e-commerce sites to have enough reliable reviews to buy anything with confidence, or do you tend to buy products that you can find reviews of elsewhere? I joke to my wife, "If 500 Germans say it's good, I'm sold"

> I feel I can trust the reviews [on Amazon Germany]

I... wouldn't do that.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#36
post #19

I'm very interested to see how Amazon's entry into the Swedish market plays out. I used to shop a lot on Amazon back when I lived in the SF Bay Area and thought I would miss it when I moved to Stockholm but honestly that has not been the case. I get 1-2 day shipping from other online retailers in Sweden anyway (like CDON and Webhallen) and there is quite fierce competition between a few of the bigger names in the gam…

I always attempt to shop from Amazon Germany because (a) larger variety of items, and (b) I feel I can trust the reviews there. Have you found Swedish e-commerce sites to have enough reliable reviews to buy anything with confidence, or do you tend to buy products that you can find reviews of elsewhere? I joke to my wife, "If 500 Germans say it's good, I'm sold"

When I lived in Sweden I was a religious user of prisjakt.nu and thought the reviews there were decent

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#37

I think the union rep from Handels is correct. They'll get Amazon to cave. Amazon is the quintessential hill to die on for the unions and the labour laws are incredibly strong in Sweden. Here's how I think it might play out if Amazon refuses to sign: - Handels requests collective bargaining - Amazon declines but are sued in court and loses (you are required to bargain) - Negotiations fail and Amazon refuses to sign -…

For a case study, look up Toys R Us' entry into Sweden.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#38
post #10

Let's see how that goes. Everybody in Sweden right now has an uneasy feeling about Amazon, and I have the impression that if people could have a referendum on the matter, Amazon wouldn't be allowed in.

>Everybody in Sweden right now has an uneasy feeling about Amazon

Everybody? I dont. Im in Sweden. So your statement is false.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#39

I think the union rep from Handels is correct. They'll get Amazon to cave. Amazon is the quintessential hill to die on for the unions and the labour laws are incredibly strong in Sweden. Here's how I think it might play out if Amazon refuses to sign: - Handels requests collective bargaining - Amazon declines but are sued in court and loses (you are required to bargain) - Negotiations fail and Amazon refuses to sign -…

I think you are mostly right. But I cannot recall when the last time was when the unions blockaded a company of Amazon's size. All my memories of this from the news involved smaller businesses, which of course crumble under the pressure. If plumbers and electricians will blockade, that is one thing, it might be possible to source these services from abroad. But if delivery drivers will not show up that is something entirely different, that is so central to their business that it is hard to circumvent.

This is maybe not a fight Amazon is eager to have in any case. So I think it will play out slightly different.

Re: Amazon’s business model meets Sweden’s labor unions

#40
post #19

I'm very interested to see how Amazon's entry into the Swedish market plays out. I used to shop a lot on Amazon back when I lived in the SF Bay Area and thought I would miss it when I moved to Stockholm but honestly that has not been the case. I get 1-2 day shipping from other online retailers in Sweden anyway (like CDON and Webhallen) and there is quite fierce competition between a few of the bigger names in the gam…

I always attempt to shop from Amazon Germany because (a) larger variety of items, and (b) I feel I can trust the reviews there. Have you found Swedish e-commerce sites to have enough reliable reviews to buy anything with confidence, or do you tend to buy products that you can find reviews of elsewhere? I joke to my wife, "If 500 Germans say it's good, I'm sold"

I actually use Amazon DE/UK/US for to look at reviews but I more often than not end up purchasing from a Swedish e-tailer. There are some exceptions though, like when the price is just much lower on Amazon DE. I had to buy a label maker last week and the price on Amazon DE for a specific model was almost 40% cheaper than buying it from a local store in Sweden.
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