Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why does China doing something make it ok for the US to do it too?
Because if you keep trying to take the "high road" you'll keep losing your IP and getting nothing for it.
What is it the US of A is now "getting"?
TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
101–110 of 372 posts
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Why can't a foreign company participate in the same? Basically foreign owned companies don't have the same constitutional rights as ones owned by US citizens - these companies operations basically being foreign commerce is where the entity list powers are derived from.
I don't believe you are correct. In the US corporations enjoy "Corporate Personhood", e.g. the corporation itself enjoys many of the same rights as a US person: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood Whether TikTok is registered as a US company may be relevant however (I would expect their local operations would be).
>I don't believe you are correct. In the US corporations enjoy "Corporate Personhood", e.g. the corporation itself enjoys many of the same rights as a US person: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood Whether TikTok is registered as a US company may be relevant however (I would expect their local operations would be).
Foreign ownership doesn't enjoy the same rights as LLCs registered in the US, ironically. For example, even though Huawei operated in the US through a US LLC, Trump still regulated its associations as defined by the foreign affairs power - as well as how corporations with US operations interacted with these foreign associated Huawei entities.
Otherwise corporate personhood would anull all trade deals in the US, and I think even the article you linked mentions their limited protections in the US.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#103Is this not a freedom of speech issue? The right is guaranteed for foreingners in the US as well. If they can ban tik tok, they can ban signal or briar because those also might send your encrypted data overseas or because their use among "violent" protestors is a risk. How about VPN apps that siphon your personal data to china and russia! Haha Here's the thing, US bigtech complies (in secret) with US intel community…
'If americans want to be spied on by China in exchange for being able to use tiktok it's their right' I think you're argument breaks down here. I don't think that handimf over information to a foreign government is a right. I was unable to Google for a definitive answer, but maybe a more knowledgeable person could chime in. The US already has export restrictions on knowledge ( for example encryption ) to foreign gove…
>The US already has export restrictions on knowledge ( for example encryption ) to foreign governments.
And normally people on this site deride such things as ridiculous (and actively worked around bans on exporting encryption), but when they find out Big Bad China might see their dance videos and lip synching suddenly they're happy to crush the free exchange of information.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#104Imagine US companies suing China for not allowing them to operate there. People would say "China can decide what they want to allow". Well if China can decide (which they did first) two can play this game. Also TikTok says this ban is baseless. If USA's ban of TikTok is baseless, what base does China have for banning everything?
> People would say "China can decide what they want to allow".
Who are you defining as “people”? I’ve only ever seen people criticize their bans on media.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
China's basis is that foreign companies won't respect their laws. What US laws has TikTok broken? Privacy isn't protected because an entire domestic industry has bought off Congress. Why can't a foreign company participate in the same?
> China's basis is that foreign companies won't respect their laws This is fallacious. China is an authoritarian regime, not a democracy under the rule of law. There are laws in China, but ultimately a corporation is subject to the whims of the Chinese Communist Party. International free market trade is founded on reciprocity - you open your markets and I open mine, under analogous regulatory conditions. Can US compa…
> China is an authoritarian regime, not a democracy under the rule of law. There are laws in China, but ultimately a corporation is subject to the whims of the Chinese Communist Party.
Would you say it's kind of like the US President being able to just ban things he just says are threats to National Security? All of the authoritarian regimes have laws that specifically allow them to do what they do. They're usually authoritarian because they can and do call everything they don't like a threat to National Security.
Where is the actual proof here? Where can everyone take a look at it?
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#106Earlier quoted context omitted.
China is a totalitarian regime which doesn't follow due process and basic freedoms. I strongly hope that your strange "tit-for-tat" doesn't extend to basic rights of people and businesses on US soil. US is supposed to be better than that, remember?
There's no "basic right" of foreign businesses to do business in the United States.
How so? Americans have the right to trade with foreign companies. Apple should have the right to trade with foreign companies, in this case, TikTok.
US restrictions on foreign trade are restrictions on Americans.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#107I hope they win. Living in China, I told my friends here that at least they will have their day in court - a win would really help show an advantage of the US system in a high-profile way. Trump is doing so much to hurt the US image among Chinese citizens right now. His administration emphasizes the importance of the distinction between the government and the people, but his actions are only driving the two closer to…
Demography is destiny. China's much larger population is churning out STEM graduates at a way faster rate than the US, and if the US loses the soft power that was previously steering the best and brightest of them to study and work in America, it will have a much harder time maintaining its technological lead.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
> China's basis is that foreign companies won't respect their laws This is fallacious. China is an authoritarian regime, not a democracy under the rule of law. There are laws in China, but ultimately a corporation is subject to the whims of the Chinese Communist Party. International free market trade is founded on reciprocity - you open your markets and I open mine, under analogous regulatory conditions. Can US compa…
> China is an authoritarian regime, not a democracy under the rule of law. There are laws in China, but ultimately a corporation is subject to the whims of the Chinese Communist Party. Would you say it's kind of like the US President being able to just ban things he just says are threats to National Security? All of the authoritarian regimes have laws that specifically allow them to do what they do. They're usually a…
Absolutely not, because the separation of powers guarantees that if he botches the Executive Order and it has no legal ground, it will fall under the weight of the Law.
No such mechanisms exists in an authoritarian regime like the Chinese.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#109> The app has also been used to antagonize the president, including when thousands of teens reserved tickets to the president's rally in Tulsa, Okla., with no intention of going, inflating the Trump campaign's expectations for the event and causing embarrassment over the disappointing turnout. Forgot that was organized on tiktok. All makes sense now. If US was really interested in national security i'm pretty sure zo…
Forgetting Trumps' feelings about the Tulsa rally, I truly believe the Tulsa thing was the smoking gun. We know that TikTok did manual moderation of topics sensitive to China, as well as some more non-ethical ones (censuring/pushing results back) of disabled and 'ugly' people. My girlfriend was offered a job moderating for TikTok and their package details with the work described left a bad taste in my mouth to be hon…
After America goes and elects a jackass like Trump, how does it matter what the CCP or Russia is capable off?
The whole discussion is unnecessary.
If someone goes and flunks an exam due to their own incompetence, does it matter what external factors can make them flunk?
Trump + other bizarre self important characters in his cabinet actually believe they know what they are doing. They don't. As to the CCP knowing what its doing is another total joke.
The moves of both sides are like watching second graders working a tenth grade problem. Its true, the tantrums the second graders throw in frustration, can be entertaining or highly dramatic. But the trap people fall into is to focus on the tantrums, forgetting whats on blackboard and whether anyone in the room has the skills to solve it.
This was all fine in the age of no information or hidden information. The game old men have learnt to play in that environment is an outdated game.
Today with data overflowing about the nature of problems, about the grade level the people in the room the game changes. And what we choose to focus on will change too.
Re: TikTok to Sue U.S. over Ban
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's no "basic right" of foreign businesses to do business in the United States.
How so? Americans have the right to trade with foreign companies. Apple should have the right to trade with foreign companies, in this case, TikTok. US restrictions on foreign trade are restrictions on Americans.
There is no right to trade with foreign companies. Try doing business with a North Korean company and see how that goes for you.