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Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

federalreserve.gov

291–300 of 431 posts

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it would not, but you could use decimals in xml. Edit: looks like there is no float in xml.

Nor are there floats in JSON! Json numbers are stored in decimal with varying lengths.

That may be technically true, but decoding sad encoding JSON without reading numbers as doubles is a special feature.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#292

I moved to India at the start of the year and there's the Universal Payment Interface (UPI) here that essentially allows a Venmo like interface to transfer $ instantaneously from any bank account to another - by simply using the recipient's phone number or a QR code. There are multiple apps that interface with UPI, and the barrier to entry isn't high - allowing for good competition on the UX. Literally every person I…

The main thing I still hate about anything that's not a wire transfer is the transfer limits, doubly true in all the fintech apps.

Hey here is this arbitrary limit for "security" purposes! Not good enough? Well now listen to this low level banker and customer support person make up a fake anti-money laundering law on the fly! We are still left wondering why the compliance team interpreted actual laws so ridiculously, or maybe this institution is just insolvent. Oh great, the entire population is also brainwashed to stigmatize ever having any actual money to transfer, can't talk to them about it either.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#293
post #130

One thing I don't see mention regarding the existing US ACH (or whatever interbank) system is that there is absolutely no verification or security in this system. Just like verification of paper check signature and a whole lot of other financial items - most banks allow anything until questioned. The easiest and cost effective way is to let it happen and reimburse for failures. 1. I have linked a non-joint account in…

Regarding #3: In general - from my time working at a phone company call center some years back - it is a much better indicator of security to ask folks to verify some account information than to try to say someone is doing something fraudulent by judging whether or not the sound of their voice matches what I think it should sound like based on their name. Verifying information tends to mean that the person has permis…

Related, though not necessarily in reply:

HSBC in the UK have a system they call "Voice ID" which claims to authenticate you by your voice: https://www.hsbc.co.uk/ways-to-bank/phone-banking/

I've not enrolled...

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#294
In 2024, USA will reach the current present in Europe ;)

Since 2017, the SEPA Instant Credit Transfer protocol is enabled in Europe. Which is basically what FedNow will be.

Multiple apps and banks have built on top of it solutions for consumers and businesses.

I interviewed Bizum, the success story of Spain related to instant payments. Here, "bizum" is a verb. 100% of banks supoort it. Everyone, kids and adults, use it to pay for beers, food or presents https://www.javierescribano.me/bizum/

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#295
post #130

One thing I don't see mention regarding the existing US ACH (or whatever interbank) system is that there is absolutely no verification or security in this system. Just like verification of paper check signature and a whole lot of other financial items - most banks allow anything until questioned. The easiest and cost effective way is to let it happen and reimburse for failures. 1. I have linked a non-joint account in…

> They didn't check my ID. I am not kidding. I did enter my ATM card and PIN. If this is the bank I think it is, once you inserted your card and entered your (valid) PIN, the teller was shown the color scan of your ID card that you presented when you opened the account. The teller then uses this to compare to you without you handing over a (possibly-faked) ID card. That is why this bank will periodically ask you to p…

I don't think either TD Canada Trust (Canada) or TD Bank (US) have ever photographed or scanned my ID, nor have they ever asked to update them.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There will be banks that offer products for handling pulls differently, it's a product decision, various features around this are available for the big boys, just haven't trickled down to the masses. But this decade they will. Has nothing to do with Fed Now. Irrevocability- for consumer payments there will always be revocability. Humans doing stuff make mistakes, and need to be able to "take it back." At the ledger l…

Irrevocability- for consumer payments there will always be revocability. And yet, if you go into a store and buy something with cash, you have never been able to just arbitrarily reverse that payment and keep the goods several months later, and the sky has not fallen. Humans doing stuff make mistakes, and need to be able to "take it back." And what about the humans who didn't make a mistake, but simply chose to abuse…

> The quasi-judicial role that financial services play in resolving disputes, often with little regulatory oversight and absolutely no requirement to be neutral or objective, is long overdue for retirement.

Honestly, from what I've heard of the US Court system, I'd much rather have the least competent bank in the country deal with my disputes than have to go through the courts. Slow, expensive, and also unjust.

I'm also under the impression that this would be a tightly regulated area but I don't know for sure.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#297
post #84

If anyone from the FED is reading this I have this advice: don't use ISO20022! (I've been working on the brazilian instant payments project, known as PIX). It's an overly-complicated-try-to-solve-everything standard that promises interoperability but only delivers pain and misery. Since each country has its own standards for person and account identification, in dealing with these local realities, the ISO20022 adds q…

I'm also working with Brazilian instant payments schema, aka PIX. We've simply created a mapping layer to convert all ISO messaging to json. Internally all our logic runs on json. It works because at the end of the day, payments only need a few fields to work: Source, Destination, Amount.

Even the BCB itself has this ISO20022-xml to simpler-schema-in-json mapping layer.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#298

I moved to India at the start of the year and there's the Universal Payment Interface (UPI) here that essentially allows a Venmo like interface to transfer $ instantaneously from any bank account to another - by simply using the recipient's phone number or a QR code. There are multiple apps that interface with UPI, and the barrier to entry isn't high - allowing for good competition on the UX. Literally every person I…

> I felt like I stepped into the future. It's more like stepping out of the past. It's not that India is particularly ahead, it's that the US is particularly behind. The EU for example has essentially instant SEPA transfers now and has done for a while.

It's counter-intuitive, but if you think about it, less develop countries are in a better position to deploy fully integrated systems.

E.g.: Portugal has a great, free, cross-bank, ATM system since the beginning [1] because Portuguese banks were late to the party in regards to deploying such machines. They could learn from other countries and create a more resilient system, which has since been expanded to be able to pay various services, from utilities, fines, tolls, phones, withdrawals without cards (with phone), etc. Countries that developed earlier have to suffer with a lot of baggage and the Banking industry is not known for it's desire to innovate its tech.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multibanco

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#299
post #294

In 2024, USA will reach the current present in Europe ;) Since 2017, the SEPA Instant Credit Transfer protocol is enabled in Europe. Which is basically what FedNow will be. Multiple apps and banks have built on top of it solutions for consumers and businesses. I interviewed Bizum, the success story of Spain related to instant payments. Here, "bizum" is a verb. 100% of banks supoort it. Everyone, kids and adults, use…

"Since 2017, the SEPA Instant Credit Transfer protocol is enabled in Europe. Which is basically what FedNow will be."

The UK has had instant interbank payments (FASTER) since May 2008 ;)

https://www.fasterpayments.org.uk/our-achievements

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The EU for example has essentially instant SEPA transfers now and has done for a while. It seems that for me (in Germany) transfers still only arrive the next business day. Something must be going on there...

There are normal SEPA transfers (taking between a few hours and 1-2 days) and there is SEPA Instant which transfers the money within a few seconds. Those are two different systems and not all banks support SEPA Instant yet. I've done a few SEPA Instant transfers in Germany already and they really arrived within a few seconds to a few minutes.

The instant trasfer costs money in Italy. I saw fees from 5 to 50 Euros.
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