Live data from Hacker News

Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

reuters.com

91–100 of 372 posts

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#91
I highly recommend doing some reading about what Xi and the CCP are really thinking and planning. It's a fascinating situation, and I'm not sure we or even they precisely know. But there has been a feel of a very dark turn overall in recent years, where perhaps an alignment between an appearance of widespread and growing failures of the US-led world order combined with China's unabated growing power, has cemented in many Chinese a sense that they truly do have the superior system. And if so we should expect to see continued growing trial runs of China flexing its increased power, in part just to see if anyone can stop them.

This recent piece from an influential Beijing professor Jiang Shigong[1] of "Xi Jinping Thought" fame, openly frames and justifies China seizing control as leader of the global empire, "Empire and World Order"[2]

[The current state of world empire] faces three great unsolvable problems: the ever-increasing inequality created by the liberal economy; state failure, political decline, and ineffective governance caused by political liberalism; and decadence and nihilism created by cultural liberalism. In the face of these difficulties, even the United States has pulled back in terms of worldwide military strategy, which means that world empire 1.0 is currently facing a great crisis, and that revolts, resistance, and revolution from within the empire are unravelling the system. ...

We might conclude that we are living in an age of chaos, conflict, and massive change in which world empire 1.0 is in decline and trending toward collapse, while we are as yet unable to imagine world empire 2.0. Yet we must recognize that change in the form of empire is a long historical process. The several thousand years of the history of mankind have witnessed only three great changes in imperial form, and each of these changes has been accompanied by great conflicts and chaos. At the same time, we cannot deny that these ages of historical transition have also created the opportunity for each civilization to construct world empire 2.0. The civilization that is able to provide genuine solutions to the three great problems facing world empire 1.0 will also provide the blueprint for world empire 2.0. As a great world power that must look beyond its own borders, China must reflect on her own future, for her important mission is not only to revive her traditional culture. China must also patiently absorb the skills and achievements of humanity as a whole, and especially those employed by Western civilization to construct world empire. Only on this basis can we see the reconstruction of Chinese civilization and the reconstruction of the world order as a mutually re-enforcing whole.

There really is a coherent internal logic to why China can solve the 3 problems identified with the liberal order. A very dystopian logic, in my opinion. But worth some serious thought; where this all is heading.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiang_Shigong

[2] https://www.readingthechinadream.com/jiang-shigong-empire-an...

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#92
post #42

The thought of living in a China-centric world during the twilight of my life on Earth (2050+) makes my hair stand on end. I do not want to be treated as a second class human because of the color of my skin or my ethnicity. I do not want to lose business and professional opportunities because I am not Han. I do not want to live in a world where freedom of speech and expression are long lost memories, where even the r…

This is the kind of comment that makes me know there's no hope for HN.

The color of your skin has bought you a lot. When you were a kid, my parents were making a dollar a day. When your parents were kids, my grandparents were facing famine. Now, finally, for the first time in all of modern history, a large group of non-white people has escaped crushing poverty. They're not rich by any means. You'd still be richer than 99.9% of your neighbors if you moved to China, and you'd still be generally worshipped for your skin color, but at the very fucking least Chinese people are no longer starving to death by the millions.

You look at this tiny measure of progress and hope, and you declare it repulsive. You think if you're no longer standing far on top of everybody else, if you sink to the 90th percentile of privilege from the 99th, you'll become a "second class human", and that possibility makes war "inevitable".

The main thing I have learned from a year of commenting on HN is that many very comfortable people here who think just like you, and it is deeply disappointing.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#93
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really shouldn't. She's alleged to have committed bank fraud against American banks. Bank fraud is a crime everywhere.

She's alleged to have been an officer in a company that disobeyed American prohibitions on trade with Iran. Calling it "bank fraud" is just a way of avoiding the question of what she did that was wrong. Who's arresting Anish Kapoor and his co-conspirators for committing fraud against Stuart Semple?

You really should go read the indictment.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#94

Why are we empowering this regime? Shouldn't we force companies like Apple to make a statement of why they manufacture their goods in China? Apple is happy make a statement about BLM - it is cheap, doesn't cost them anything. But when it comes to things that actually harm profits and challenge shareholder responsibilities, they stay mum. We need to force Apple (and other giant corporations) to speak up about atrociti…

I'm on board as soon as we explain why we allow Donald Trump to have the launch codes.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#95
post #4

As an anecdote, someone I know is an immigrant from HK and has lived in the USA for many years, and this person is afraid of saying anything publicly against China out of fear. Fear for their family in China and fear for their personal safety even in the USA. Similar to how Russia murders defectors [0], it’s not a good idea to be an expat and criticize China. It is an authoritarian regime, bottom line. [0] https://en…

As an anecdote, I hear people call out the CPC in public places in China.

I wonder if this is either very recent (since I haven't been there in over 6 months) or fairly old (before Xi took power). I could hear regular complaints about corruption, governance, and even government, but not the party itself (or particularly and most recently Xi). Granted I've mostly been in northern and central/western China rather than the south, but Guandong and Shenzhen didn't seem that different except for the Canton influence.

I have not (over 20 years) had an open political conversation about the party in China and I would never ask my friends there to entertain it even in the US. There is no point. Even in the US I would only discuss US politics, although they often seemed to be effectively related.

I will say that one of the formative descriptions of Chinese history was in the summer palace next to a statue of an emperor (Ming?) who had commited suicide upon being overthrown... he was by account terrible at ruling so I asked why there was a ;large statue. The answer was that by killing himself and not forcing the soldiers to fight and mandarins to destroy records he had maintained stability. This may be apocryphal, but the stories people tell about themselves are very illuminating.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#96

Why are we empowering this regime? Shouldn't we force companies like Apple to make a statement of why they manufacture their goods in China? Apple is happy make a statement about BLM - it is cheap, doesn't cost them anything. But when it comes to things that actually harm profits and challenge shareholder responsibilities, they stay mum. We need to force Apple (and other giant corporations) to speak up about atrociti…

> But when it comes to things that actually harm profits and challenge shareholder responsibilities, they stay mum.

Cynical but this is why- it would cost them a lot, at least today. The Chinese government has zero reservations about sandbagging US corporations that publicly critique it or otherwise don't fall in line - just ask Google, Facebook, or the Houston Rockets. You wont hear a peep out of Apple until they're 100% sure they can break ties and afford any assets seized, have no personnel abroad, etc.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#97
post #80

This is crazy. First the Muslim concentration camps, now this. Why won't the Western world impose any serious sanctions against China? We have invaded others countries for less

Countries with nukes and 2M+ man armies? Besides, too much is at stake by our corporate overlords to put military action or sanctions on the table. Sadly, Hong Kongers need to steel themselves for some tough struggle sessions.

Airplanes are so expensive and non survivable these days that IMO the next war will be a massive air battle with whoever loses unable to replenish and therefore forced to surrender or be picked apart from the air or escalate. America currently has 10x the aircraft China has and the logistics to back them up (China is catching up). A 2m man army will likely be irrelevant except for fighting regionally, if their enemy has air superiority they will not be very effective.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't Apple moving to India? https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/08/03/six-apple-product... I suspect that Apple is moving away from China, but the reality is that doing so takes time.

That is most probably Apple doing diversification to avoid SPoF and taking advantages of tax breaks. They will never stand up for these things because they don't just manufacture, they sell a lot of devices there.

Doing any amount of supply chain and manufacturing diversification now is still an option expanding choice in the long run.

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#99
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is one does not know if they'll come or not. That is not the point. There is a general fear amongst the people that they'll be targeted for speaking out. Effectively blocking freedom of speech.

That's a false statement. There is general understanding one will only be questioned if the misinformation has caused a significant financial or social impact.

> will only be questioned if the misinformation has caused a significant financial or social impact

Oh good, so I'm free to speak my own opinion as long as I don't actually try to accomplish anything!

Re: Hong Kong media tycoon Jimmy Lai arrested under national security law

#100
post #92
post #42

The thought of living in a China-centric world during the twilight of my life on Earth (2050+) makes my hair stand on end. I do not want to be treated as a second class human because of the color of my skin or my ethnicity. I do not want to lose business and professional opportunities because I am not Han. I do not want to live in a world where freedom of speech and expression are long lost memories, where even the r…

This is the kind of comment that makes me know there's no hope for HN. The color of your skin has bought you a lot. When you were a kid, my parents were making a dollar a day. When your parents were kids, my grandparents were facing famine. Now, finally, for the first time in all of modern history, a large group of non-white people has escaped crushing poverty. They're not rich by any means. You'd still be richer tha…

[flagged]
Post reply on HN