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A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

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Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#11

Post by jessaustin »

someperson wrote: post #9
pm90 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am afraid that what happens in the upcoming election will be a referendum on what kind of country the US will become, and what kind of reaction it will have to the urgent existential problems the world faces today. If the current administration persists, I do not see any genuine way that the country could tackle these problems. Just look at the completely botched non-response to the current pandemic at the Federal…

It's off-topic, but (as a non-American) I personally believe Trump will win re-election. Steve Bannon (the architect of Trump's 2016 election win) has said Trump will win re-election if the Chinese Communist Party is the central issue of the election (which it increasingly is). Come November they'll likely be multiple vaccine candidates in late-stage trials, and the compelling argument can be made saying the botched…

[flagged]

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#12

Post by someperson »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #10
someperson wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's off-topic, but (as a non-American) I personally believe Trump will win re-election. Steve Bannon (the architect of Trump's 2016 election win) has said Trump will win re-election if the Chinese Communist Party is the central issue of the election (which it increasingly is). Come November they'll likely be multiple vaccine candidates in late-stage trials, and the compelling argument can be made saying the botched…

The CCP isn't a tremendously controversial issue in the US (the consensus against it is strong and bipartisan), so it's hard to see how it could become the central issue of the election.

The issue is Biden appears much weaker than Trump on China. He has the baggage of being an Obama administration official (overseeing the South China Sea militarization and the US-China Cyber Agreement).

Some core Trump advisors like Peter Navarro (author of "Death by China" and the associated documentary) believe in economic decoupling far more deeply Biden advisors.

I agree some Democratic leaders like Chuck Schumer are hawks on China, but a Biden administration would be far less hawkish on the CCP issue than Trump.

I can see Trump using the 'nuclear option' and cutting off Hong Kong's ability to conduct transactions in US dollars (fatally killing the Hong Kong economy and deeply damaging China's, and far less so America's). I can't see Biden doing that.

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#13

Post by evan_ »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #10
someperson wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's off-topic, but (as a non-American) I personally believe Trump will win re-election. Steve Bannon (the architect of Trump's 2016 election win) has said Trump will win re-election if the Chinese Communist Party is the central issue of the election (which it increasingly is). Come November they'll likely be multiple vaccine candidates in late-stage trials, and the compelling argument can be made saying the botched…

The CCP isn't a tremendously controversial issue in the US (the consensus against it is strong and bipartisan), so it's hard to see how it could become the central issue of the election.

“Disapprove” vs. “go to war with”

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#14

Post by freeopinion »

I grew up with a cold war era US-centric understanding of why Hiroshima and Nagasaki had to happen. I get those arguments, Later I was taught a very different, also compelling, rationale for Nagazaki from a Japanese perspective. I get that argument, too.

I'm USian, so of course I like any argument that puts the US on the right side of history. But as that moment gets more and more into the past, and we lose the context of culture, etc of that time, what is left is that the US intentionally killed thousands of civilians to demonstrate military prowess and intimidate the opposition.

I've been taught the nuances. I've accepted them and perhaps even clung to them. As time passes, even USians might feel less need to keep the memory of those nuances alive. But the horror of that action doesn't go away.

I grew up learning about Christopher Columbus, and Pocahontas and Thomas Jefferson, and all the narrative we learned decades ago. Especially lately there has been a lot different version of much of those stories. Some see people and actions of the past as heroic, others see them as hideous.

I do not personally condemn decision makers of WWII. I am grateful for the sacrifices of past generations. But the fact remains that the US is the only country in the history of the world that has ever used a nuclear weapon in anger. That is extremely humbling.

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#15

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

someperson wrote: post #12
SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The CCP isn't a tremendously controversial issue in the US (the consensus against it is strong and bipartisan), so it's hard to see how it could become the central issue of the election.

The issue is Biden appears much weaker than Trump on China. He has the baggage of being an Obama administration official (overseeing the South China Sea militarization and the US-China Cyber Agreement). Some core Trump advisors like Peter Navarro (author of "Death by China" and the associated documentary) believe in economic decoupling far more deeply Biden advisors. I agree some Democratic leaders like Chuck Schumer…

Again, I'm not saying you're wrong, it's just hard to imagine such nitty-gritty details of the US-China relationship being the central issue of this election.

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#16

Post by someperson »

jessaustin wrote: post #11
someperson wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's off-topic, but (as a non-American) I personally believe Trump will win re-election. Steve Bannon (the architect of Trump's 2016 election win) has said Trump will win re-election if the Chinese Communist Party is the central issue of the election (which it increasingly is). Come November they'll likely be multiple vaccine candidates in late-stage trials, and the compelling argument can be made saying the botched…

[flagged]

From what I've read it's very likely they'll be rolling out vaccines with ~50% effectiveness this year (and deploying it in high volumes in 2021). The vaccine doesn't have to be perfect. As long as it's proven safe, confers some level of protection and is deployed in badly affected areas (including nursing homes) it will help drop the death numbers and we'll reach herd immunity faster.

Operation Warp Speed has meant a huge amount tax payer money is being thrown at this.

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#18

Post by 082349872349872 »

googthrowaway42 wrote: post #7
someperson wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't mean to hijack the discussion. I agree that Imperial Japan, Maoist China and Soviet Russia killed tens of millions of people, and Europe/United States had similar number of deaths in World War 1 and 2. I know there is terrible atrocities taking place right now all over the world. From the ethno-religious concentration camps, to human trafficking and slavery, forced prison labor etc. My comment was in context…

Seems to me that in order to take away any truly valuable lessons from some historical event, you have to understand the context in which it occurred. Generally speaking, humans are very bad at actually understanding how they themselves would actually feel, react, or behave in a similar situation. It's kind of like people who talk all the time about entrepreneurship or starting their own company but then never actual…

The general context of this particular anniversary is the "short twentieth century", from 28 July 1914 to 26 December 1991.

In particular, the significance of the first date helps explain why it would be the US making a first strike, and the significance of the second date why it they held it necessary to make a countervalue strike.

(Afterwards, 31 March 1991-12 November 2001 —from which we have many refugees— would start the twenty-first century of "nationalistic" fake news.)

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#19

Post by khuey »

someperson wrote: post #9
pm90 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am afraid that what happens in the upcoming election will be a referendum on what kind of country the US will become, and what kind of reaction it will have to the urgent existential problems the world faces today. If the current administration persists, I do not see any genuine way that the country could tackle these problems. Just look at the completely botched non-response to the current pandemic at the Federal…

It's off-topic, but (as a non-American) I personally believe Trump will win re-election. Steve Bannon (the architect of Trump's 2016 election win) has said Trump will win re-election if the Chinese Communist Party is the central issue of the election (which it increasingly is). Come November they'll likely be multiple vaccine candidates in late-stage trials, and the compelling argument can be made saying the botched…

I'm not sure you understand how bad the coronavirus situation is here. People's kids aren't going to be able to go to school in person this fall. Short of the outbreak of WW3 I can't imagine the pandemic not being the top issue.

Re: A man who saved Kyoto from the atomic bomb (2015)

#20

Post by drewcoo »

pm90 wrote: post #8
someperson wrote: post #3

On this historic day (exactly 75 years to the day since the August 9 1945 atomic bombing of Nagasaki) we should take a moment to understand more about our shared history. > But he was also behind the internment of more than 100,000 Japanese Americans because, as Mr Stimson put it, "their racial characteristics are such that we cannot understand or trust even the citizen Japanese". The internment of Japanese-Americans…

I am afraid that what happens in the upcoming election will be a referendum on what kind of country the US will become, and what kind of reaction it will have to the urgent existential problems the world faces today. If the current administration persists, I do not see any genuine way that the country could tackle these problems. Just look at the completely botched non-response to the current pandemic at the Federal…

Just like Pepsi vs Coca-Cola was a referendum on what liquids would exist so now the earth is 70% covered in Coke? This isn't that timeline, friend.
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