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Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

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Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#221

Post by sukilot »

reillyse wrote: post #109
ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

I don't think he is saying that encrypted communication should be illegal. He's saying that spreading lies through encrypted channels should be stopped. It would not be hard for WhatsApp to prevent people from spreading bogus videos, because they have access to the unencrypted information before and after sending. So either preventing people from sharing misinformation or preventing people from reading the misinforma…

Then why did he mention encryption?

> (I wouldn't see a problem with it personally

The POTUS said CNN is fake news, hundreds of times. So, as you say, people should be prevented from sharing and reading it?! There's no problem with that?! The very first item on the USA Bill of Rights isn't important?

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#222

Post by usrusr »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #200
reillyse wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think he is saying that encrypted communication should be illegal. He's saying that spreading lies through encrypted channels should be stopped. It would not be hard for WhatsApp to prevent people from spreading bogus videos, because they have access to the unencrypted information before and after sending. So either preventing people from sharing misinformation or preventing people from reading the misinforma…

"It would be hard for WhatsApp to prevent people from spreading bogus videos, because they have access to the unencrypted information before and after sending." Facebook/WhatsApp claims WhatsApp messages are "end-to-end" encypted. For example, here https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:https:... Are the "end-to-end" encryption claims irrelevant if "they have access to the unecncypted information befor…

They could put a tiny truth ministry module in the app and remain e2e:

"I'll be on my way home in five minutes!" [send]

"Sorry, our algorithms have detected that you were about to spread misinformation. Please contact support to reactivate your account. Premium support is available to subscribers of our membership programme"

I'm actually only half joking: while some local library code surely cannot tell truth from lies, that problem remains just as unsolved for arbitrary amounts of central effort. There's a reason truth ministries are a Bad Idea.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#223

Post by jlokier »

Orou wrote: post #171
reillyse wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure there is evidence for or against. The argument I would make is not about censorship but preventing people from spreading lies. Even in the US where people hold free speech as some amazingly virtuous thing there are still curbs on speech, and what I'm saying is these limitations can be enforced in WhatsApp. Maybe you think that is censorship maybe you don't. Also on that point, the freedom of speech in th…

> The argument I would make is not about censorship but preventing people from spreading lies. Limiting speech is by definition censorship. There's no value judgement required as to the quality or veracity of that speech to determine whether or not restricting it counts as censorship. > the freedom of speech in the US is strongly correlated with conspiracy theories ...and water is highly correlated with drowning. We…

> Limiting speech is by definition censorship.

Preventing speech is censorship.

But discouraging the spreading of a message at each spreader, for example by letting the spreader know the message is tagged as misleading by some large number of people before they spread it further is not censorship.

That may limit the rate, intensity, and real-world effect of some kinds of information, without fundamentally limiting the right to free speech.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#224

Post by sukilot »

kebman wrote: post #190
reillyse wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure there is evidence for or against. The argument I would make is not about censorship but preventing people from spreading lies. Even in the US where people hold free speech as some amazingly virtuous thing there are still curbs on speech, and what I'm saying is these limitations can be enforced in WhatsApp. Maybe you think that is censorship maybe you don't. Also on that point, the freedom of speech in th…

The best way to fight the spread of lies is: 1. To spread truth 2. To hold people accountable for what they say

#2 how?

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#225

Post by sukilot »

partyboat1586 wrote: post #105
ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

He's thinking from a pragmatic, utilitarian mindset. He has no principles surrounding privacy. If it has to be sacrificed to get the job done that's fine in his mind as long as it's a net positive.

That's totalitarian not utilitarian.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#226

Post by wittyreference »

ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

Quick point: the entire controversial/nuanced part of that statement happened in the summary/paraphrase brackets, not his own words.

If you're sitting here going, "gosh, I wonder why someone that well-informed would say that?!", I'd point out that you don't actually know the full detail of what he said.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#227

Post by zarkov99 »

lostlogin wrote: post #26
ffggvv wrote: post #3

My key takeaways Against how our govt handled covid: >> The irony is that this is a president who is a vaccine skeptic. Every meeting I have with him he is like, “Hey, I don’t know about vaccines, and you have to meet with this guy Robert Kennedy Jr. who hates vaccines and spreads crazy stuff about them.” >> Well, that’s just stupidity. The majority of all US tests are completely garbage, wasted. If you don’t care ho…

> My key takeaways Against govt handling of covid: To be fair, there aren’t many governments ‘handling’ Covid in anything like a manner that has been good.

To be fairer, the US isn't just any government. Asides from being the richest and most advanced nation in he world, as Gates points out the US also has the best epidemiologists in the world. One would expect better.

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#228

Post by sukilot »

mdoms wrote: post #71
refurb wrote: post #36

Maybe it’s just me, but I find it odd that Gates is the go to source for public health issues. His biggest contribution is money, which pays for really smart people to tackle these issues. So why not talk to the really smart people he hired?

Bill Gates is a public health expert. He has been working on these problems with some of the smartest minds in the field for decades now. How long does someone need to be working on a problem before they're worthy of being a "go to source", in your opinion?

Why do we want to hear from Fauci instead of Trump?

Why get information thirdhand from the money guy?

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#229

Post by [deleted] »

H8crilA wrote: post #135
ani-ani wrote: post #93

He is easily one of the least bullshit-y sources when it comes to handling of COVID. But then there's this right in the middle of the interview: " And when you have [posts] encrypted, there is no way to know what it is. I personally believe government should not allow those types of lies or fraud or child pornography [to be hidden with encryption like WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger] ". Quite literally, encrypted comm…

This is just Gates venting out, dude is sooo frustrated. Imagine doing as much as he did and still getting horseshit accusations about putting chips into people's bodies or whatever new nonsense they will come up in 6 months.

[deleted]

Re: Interview with Bill Gates on Covid, social media

#230

Post by refurb »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #41
refurb wrote: post #36

Maybe it’s just me, but I find it odd that Gates is the go to source for public health issues. His biggest contribution is money, which pays for really smart people to tackle these issues. So why not talk to the really smart people he hired?

For a couple of reasons; Gates is well known and will draw more visibility. He’s a well trained public speaker. He knows enough about the subject matter to communicate it effectively. Also, a short interview probably isn’t long enough for someone with deep subject knowledge to scratch the surface.

Ok, I’ll buy the visibility thing. When Gates talks about anything people will listen.

Maybe it’s just the cynic in me, but it comes across as a bit of “billionaire worship”.

“He’s made lots of money, so he must be brilliant and I want to hear what brilliant people think about Covid.”

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