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How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

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Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#51

Post by seebetter »

oefrha wrote: post #42
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #27

The scale of their IP theft is incredible. The CFO survey said it is happening to 1 in 5 US corporations, which is incredible if you think about it - but the trouble is the scale is larger than that, when you include what they steal via surveillance too. I can't see an answer outside of decoupling, seeing as they're set on their path and proud of it. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/1-in-5-companies-say-china-s...

Sounds impressive, then you read the article and realize they surveyed 23 companies in total. I don’t even know what’s 1 in 5 in that context. Four? Five?

> One in five North American-based corporations on the CNBC Global CFO Council says Chinese companies have stolen their intellectual property within the last year. In all, 7 of the 23 companies surveyed say that Chinese firms have stolen from them over the past decade.

I don’t see this as a minimized fact.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#52

Post by Wolfenstein98k »

matz1 wrote: post #40
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #27

The scale of their IP theft is incredible. The CFO survey said it is happening to 1 in 5 US corporations, which is incredible if you think about it - but the trouble is the scale is larger than that, when you include what they steal via surveillance too. I can't see an answer outside of decoupling, seeing as they're set on their path and proud of it. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/1-in-5-companies-say-china-s...

>I can't see an answer outside of decoupling Maybe stop relying on IP as your business strategy ? Always be innovating so that you always be one step ahead those who copying.

How do you out-innovate a country which has less regulation, more intrusive surveillance, more factories ready to churn out whatever you invent, more workers (and Uighur slaves) ready to do the labour for less, and no qualms about stealing anything and everything you come up with and copying it at a scale you can't possibly match?

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#53

Post by Wolfenstein98k »

murgindrag wrote: post #48
corty wrote: post #3

The article gives several possible ways to improve the situation. However, one critical way is missing imho: China forces foreign investment to always come in the form of a joint venture with a Chinese company. This practice needs to be forbidden or heavily penalized in all future trade agreements and similar international contracts.

Or reciprocated. Chinese citizens have invested a ton in US businesses, which is sort of okay. They also bought a ton of land in the US, which led to skyrocketing housing prices, and in the long term, if it continues unabated, will lead to the US paying tribute to China in the form of rents on US land. There is no upside to this. We got cheap Chinese plastic trinkets. They got our real estate. Didn't we do this to th…

Here in Australia, it's a giant issue too. There are plenty of houses which are Chinese-owned but unoccupied. They are effectively "banks" for storing cash. The scale is shocking, our "foreign ownership" figures for real estate are entirely skewed to this one country.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#54

Post by mattmanser »

kiba wrote: post #32
mattmanser wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No-one has yet, but what's the problem with it? America stole Britain's intellectual property for a leg up a century or two ago, now a different country is doing it to them. It's just the normal cycle, and America have long had a lot of artificial legal protections in place to try and stop it and limit the rest of the world's prosperity. The harsh copyright laws and IP agreements they've bullied the rest of the world…

America stole Britain's intellectual property for a leg up a century or two ago, now a different country is doing it to them. There's a difference between copying from open source patent database and reverse engineering versus blatantly engaging in industrial espionage, which is a whole another kettle of fish. Or claiming to be playing by the same set of rules but blatantly violating them. The harsh copyright laws an…

I think you need to read up on your history. Here's an easy place to start.

https://www.google.com/search?q=america+stole+britain+intell...

There's plenty of documented evidence that America illegally stole tons of IP, often paid for by the state no less, otherwise known as industrial espionage.

I'm sure they did it to all the European powers of the time too, probably plenty of examples of stolen tech from Spain, the Dutch, etc.

As I'm sure Britain, etc. did to the civilizations more advanced to them in the centuries before too, you can bet there were proclamations about not taking technology out of the cities that had monopolies on them, and were smuggled out illegally or simply attacked for them.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#55

Post by fxtentacle »

secondcoming wrote: post #23
hummel wrote: post #13

It seems that Mr. Saleen has suffered the same fate that my electric car company suffered in 2010. After promising us a partnership, his only intention was to obtain the technology and the secrets, at that time one of the few complete EV powertrains on the market. As soon as the contracts were signed and the technology was evaluated, two separate companies were set up based on the same technology.I have to say that t…

This is sad but true. There are some very interesting channels on youtube made by westerners who live in, or used to, China e.g. Serpentza. Some of them are quite eye-opening, especially more recent ones from when the CCP decided having foreigners in China is a bad thing. The videos from years ago were quite positive, but honest, generally about China. Not any more.

That sounds very interesting. Do you have some links to videos, both old an new, to illustrate the trend?

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#56

Post by matz1 »

Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #52
matz1 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I can't see an answer outside of decoupling Maybe stop relying on IP as your business strategy ? Always be innovating so that you always be one step ahead those who copying.

How do you out-innovate a country which has less regulation, more intrusive surveillance, more factories ready to churn out whatever you invent, more workers (and Uighur slaves) ready to do the labour for less, and no qualms about stealing anything and everything you come up with and copying it at a scale you can't possibly match?

Maybe try do the same thing? Less regulation, more factory, more monitoring doesn't always mean bad thing. Cheap worker can probably be replaced with advance automation. I disagree that its a "stealing", you still have the knowledge.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#57

Post by kiba »

mattmanser wrote: post #54
kiba wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America stole Britain's intellectual property for a leg up a century or two ago, now a different country is doing it to them. There's a difference between copying from open source patent database and reverse engineering versus blatantly engaging in industrial espionage, which is a whole another kettle of fish. Or claiming to be playing by the same set of rules but blatantly violating them. The harsh copyright laws an…

I think you need to read up on your history. Here's an easy place to start. https://www.google.com/search?q=america+stole+britain+intell... There's plenty of documented evidence that America illegally stole tons of IP, often paid for by the state no less, otherwise known as industrial espionage. I'm sure they did it to all the European powers of the time too, probably plenty of examples of stolen tech from Spain, the…

Too much effort? America llegally stole tons of IP, otherwise known as industrial espionage.

What about it? That was over a century ago. It still doesn't make China's industrial espionage ethical or right.

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#58

Post by fxtentacle »

hummel wrote: post #13

It seems that Mr. Saleen has suffered the same fate that my electric car company suffered in 2010. After promising us a partnership, his only intention was to obtain the technology and the secrets, at that time one of the few complete EV powertrains on the market. As soon as the contracts were signed and the technology was evaluated, two separate companies were set up based on the same technology.I have to say that t…

Could you post an article that explains the concept of guanxi?

Re: How Chinese Officials Hijacked My Company

#60

Post by innagadadavida »

seebetter wrote: post #51
oefrha wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds impressive, then you read the article and realize they surveyed 23 companies in total. I don’t even know what’s 1 in 5 in that context. Four? Five?

> One in five North American-based corporations on the CNBC Global CFO Council says Chinese companies have stolen their intellectual property within the last year. In all, 7 of the 23 companies surveyed say that Chinese firms have stolen from them over the past decade. I don’t see this as a minimized fact.

The rest of them could be silent due to pressure from CCP. So this problem might be more widespread than companies are reporting.
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