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US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

asia.nikkei.com

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Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#411

Post by ejanus »

dvcrn wrote: post #403
ejanus wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wrong! How come same companies you mentioned are doing well every other place except in China? Don't you see this as odd?

This isn't an argument. In most countries you have some local competitors that do better than global brands. Not every app has to be a global success to be highly profitable Korea has KakaoTalk that's undefeated as the defacto chat app (and now search engine and payment provider). It's not doing well in every other place except Korea. Japan has LINE as it's primary messenger, payment app, etc. It has some foot in oth…

I am not ruling out your points, they are sound and I agree with them. But look at it this way, you have 100 companies and all of them failed woefully in only one particular market. This doesn't look like natural event , it looks more like a biased coin.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#412

Post by orbifold »

tonfa wrote: post #404
pjc50 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the 36,000 US troops in Germany? EU countries don't get to have "national security" that conflicts with the US to more than a trivial extent, like the Airbus/Boeing conflict. That's been a tradeoff that was accepted since the end of WW2. The US now complains about Europe not having strong militaries, having forgotten that for decades it was policy to discourage Europe from having strong militaries in case that…

> Maybe the 36,000 US troops in Germany? Do german people really care about those? (besides the obvious economic benefits in the towns where those troops are stationed due to local spending) I always thought it benefited the US more than germany (easier access to eastern europe and middle east).

I think GP meant to imply that parts of the EU are effectively still US client states and not totally void of US influence on their politics. It's pretty common for top politicians in Germany to be part of some transatlantic organisation set up by the US ("Atlantikbrücke", ...). Same goes for journalists in leading news papers, which will result in more favourable US press coverage.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#413

Post by baybal2 »

exprath35 wrote: post #190
thewarrior wrote: post #43

Some people here are wondering about the implications of this. What this means IMO is that all Chinese investments in SV need to be liquidated at fire sale prices in the next 45 days. Regardless of how people here feel about China this is a huge escalation. The US is inflicting huge losses on Chinese companies for no clear violation of US laws on their part. The pandoras box is now open. Do countries get to do this t…

> Do countries get to do this to each other whenever they feel like it now ? Can China force Tesla to sell its Chinese operations because Teslas data gathering poses a national security risk ? Yes? Are you unaware that China has been doing exactly this for many, many years? Just as two examples, AWS was forced by China to sell off its Chinese operations to a Chinese company because of arbitrary national security reas…

1. No foreign company is allowed to run a telecom business in China

Telecom thus involves anything with a computer, and any "com," being applied with arbitrary eagerness.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#414

Post by comoesposible »

puranjay wrote: post #328
tannhaeuser wrote: post #324

I don't get it. It's US companies standing to loose their stronghold (near monopoly) on social, advertisement, and other forms of monetizing the web if the US creates a precedent for "national security" in this way, as in "we're welcoming social networks and free speech as long as it benefits the US and can be searched without warrant." Quite predictably, governments all over the world will be pressurized to question…

What's stopping Volkswagen from lobbying Germany to ban Teslas because all the cameras in it pose a "national security risk"? This is, by all account, a shortsighted move

That's comparing apples and elephants. Also, there are already laws in Germany about how long such images may be stored and how they may be used.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#415

Post by crawlcrawler »

PikachuEXE wrote: post #369
ejanus wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if Chinese social media firms are freely operating in the USA why can't the likes of FB and Twitter be allowed same free access in their market. Let's not see this as harming anybody but this is one of the ways to force China to open up and allow foreign businesses(social media) to spread in their domain. Imagine being forced to open a WeChat account just to chat with someone in China. If this kind of business mo…

Agreed. It's the China government started the trend of banning apps from foreign countries so that their own companies can grow and spread outside China. I see this ban as a late but fair move.

>> I see this ban as a late but fair move.

A late but fair move to achieve what, exactly?

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#416

Post by MattGaiser »

learnstats2 wrote: post #399
hintymad wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this just reciprocity? China banned a long list of media companies: FB, Google, YouTube, Twitter, Netflix, and every traditional media. Now the US is banning two apps made in China.

It feels unequal after this was called censorship and anti-democratic, being used as a basis for propaganda against China, for years?

I suspect the ban will just be on the monetization. So they can keep TikTok and WeChat, but will not be able to profit from them.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#417

Post by baybal2 »

thewarrior wrote: post #75
rtx wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are your views on IP theft by some companies there. Should that be considered first strike by China.

China says if you want to set up a factory in China you need to transfer IP. They aren't forcing western companies to invest. Most companies invested voluntarily. And this was seen as mostly OK when the rivalry wasn't as heated.

Counterexamples are right around the corner. I myself know like 10 people who came to China and opened factories without any JV involvement.

A reputable quote please for who, and when was forced to do an IP transfer

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#418

Post by RavlaAlvar »

keiferski wrote: post #102
thewarrior wrote: post #43

Some people here are wondering about the implications of this. What this means IMO is that all Chinese investments in SV need to be liquidated at fire sale prices in the next 45 days. Regardless of how people here feel about China this is a huge escalation. The US is inflicting huge losses on Chinese companies for no clear violation of US laws on their part. The pandoras box is now open. Do countries get to do this t…

Can China force Tesla to sell its Chinese operations because Teslas data gathering poses a national security risk ? China can force any company out of the country for any arbitrary reason whatsoever. As far as I know, they are still banning Houston Rockets games because Morey supported Hong Kong in a tweet.

Foreign investors were forced to sell their shares on Ant finance(Alipay) few years ago.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#419

Post by gr2zr4 »

tannhaeuser wrote: post #324

I don't get it. It's US companies standing to loose their stronghold (near monopoly) on social, advertisement, and other forms of monetizing the web if the US creates a precedent for "national security" in this way, as in "we're welcoming social networks and free speech as long as it benefits the US and can be searched without warrant." Quite predictably, governments all over the world will be pressurized to question…

What still amazes me after 5 (?) years since Snowden's revelations it's how EU hasn't banned US social platforms yet.

Re: US to ban transactions with ByteDance and WeChat in 45 days

#420

Post by orbifold »

donw wrote: post #337
tannhaeuser wrote: post #324

I don't get it. It's US companies standing to loose their stronghold (near monopoly) on social, advertisement, and other forms of monetizing the web if the US creates a precedent for "national security" in this way, as in "we're welcoming social networks and free speech as long as it benefits the US and can be searched without warrant." Quite predictably, governments all over the world will be pressurized to question…

The US lost that near-monopoly years ago. Broadly speaking, I think we're witnessing the birth of three distinct global powers. One is centered on the US, and consists (broadly) of Canada, Mexico, the rest of Latin America, the Commonwealth nations, Japan, Korea, Israel, and Taiwan. An American civil war would destabilize this to a large degree, so we'll have to see if that plays out. Edit, since people seem confused…

A German, French and Russian alliance is probably the winning move and was thwarted more than once by Anglo-Saxon intervention. Right now the US actively tries to sabotage the Nordstream 2 completion (https://www.dw.com/de/ist-nord-stream-2-noch-zu-retten/a-538...), which would make Germany energy independent from US controlled Gas.
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