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A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

bbc.com

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Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#61

Post by wiz21c »

mehrdadn wrote: post #25
messo wrote: post #22

> The emissions from travel it took to report this story were 0kg CO2. The digital emissions from this story are an estimated 1.2g to 3.6g CO2 per page view. Maybe this is what finally could push companies towards making lighter and more efficient websites? At least an estimate of a webpages watt usage (server and client side).

> The digital emissions from this story are an estimated 1.2g to 3.6g CO2 per page view. Holy cow, that is a lot . 1-3 grams of CO2 per single load of a page? Makes me feel guilty about even clicking the article.

Just watching a movie about CO2 emissions is order of magnitudes above.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#62

Post by pjc50 »

reportgunner wrote: post #51
pjc50 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average human breathes out 1g of CO2 every minute and a half. By comparison, average UK cars put out 124.5g for every km driven. It's not nothing, but it's not a lot either. It probably is worth evaluating the electrical efficiency of the tech industry as a whole, both in terms of highly executed code hotspots and entire pieces of business of questionable utility (ad javascript, cryptocurrency proof-of-waste), bu…

What is the comparison of the number of cars in the world versus the number of people in the world ?

Estimates of vehicles in use (including commercial) seem to be about 1.2 billion. But the relevant number is surely total miles driven?

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#63

Post by Zeebrommer »

barbegal wrote: post #40

Are there any technical details available for this system? The linked article doesn't do a good job of explaining how it works or how much impact it will have. Assuming the boat can harness 10% of the wave's energy, wave power in the Philippines is more like 10kW per meter of wave length captured on average so that equates to ~1kW per metre of wave. Let's assume this boat can capture roughly 10m of wave then that is…

This is exactly the kind of order-of-magnitude estimation that I was looking for in the article. Where did you get the wave energy numbers?

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#64

Post by Twisell »

codegrappler wrote: post #58
Twisell wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rest assured that you can make the numbers even worse by using a VPN thus requiring even more intermediate servers and cryptographic computations. But before admonishing users please consider defending Net Neutrality and copyright reforms so that theses workaround become useless (for general usage). And while you are at it don't refrain from taxing ad-networks that use bandwidth and cpu cycle with over-engineered adw…

How is this comment admonishing users? It looks like an attempt to put mathematical justification to a claim.

The comment is not admonishing anyone, it's about the underlying narrative the comment is addressing.

Sorry my ironic and rhetorical intentions might not have been clear enough, English is not my mother tongue so I might been confusing here.

Basically my point is that heavy calculation about "X is emitting Y shame on you people" is too often used as decoy so you never actually audit Z.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#65

Post by lm28469 »

bnegreve wrote: post #19
just-ok wrote: post #5

It’s honestly a shame that we didn’t keep pursuing sail technology. It’s great that we’re finally getting somewhere environmentally-friendly with ship tech nowadays as in the OP, but if we’d put the same amount of effort to innovate and advance sails like we did steam, I imagine we’d have pretty amazing (and completely green) methods of transport for all but the heaviest cargo loads (and even then, just split the loa…

> It’s honestly a shame that we didn’t keep pursuing sail technology. We did, modern sail boats are much faster than they used to be and can almost sail against the wind (~30° from the wind direction). Fastest sail boats can cross the Atlantic in few days now. (speed record: 3days15h [1]) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transatlantic_sailing_record

Isn't it purely for sport though ?

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#66

Post by proto-n »

danielbarla wrote: post #59
barbegal wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the methodology https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200131-why-and-how-does... I think most of it comes from your client device. Your laptop may be using 50W of power or about 20g of CO2 per hour so reading the article for 6 minutes is ~2g of CO2.

That makes quite a lot of sense, but it also makes me frown a bit at the phrasing, which I feel is quite misleading. "The digital emissions from this story are an estimated 1.2g to 3.6g CO2 per page view." Re-reading it, technically they are right, if "view" is taken in a non-technical fashion. But everyone reading that text would assume if they click refresh, the emissions are doubled. Also, I do wonder if they take…

Also why not add sustinance cost for the human looking at the device then? Food, water, heating/cooling, clothes, glasses, etc...

Proportionally for 2 minutes of course.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#67

Post by julosflb »

Theodores wrote: post #54

This is a great endeavour but where is the scale model that proved the concept? I know scale models don't meet up with realistic waves when on a pond but it would be nice to see this working. As it is the story is not there yet!

Indeed. A pond will probably not have the right wave. But the concept can be easily tested with a small scale model in any of the numerous wave tanks around the world for a tiny fraction of the cost of a full scale prototype... This kind of wave action scales very well using so called Froud scaling.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#68

Post by julosflb »

Xylakant wrote: post #33
bigbluedots wrote: post #29

Aren't all ships partly powered by wave energy if they're facing the right way?

No, generally speaking, waves pass underneath a floating object in practically all circumstances. You may feel like there’s a forward surge when a wave comes in from behind, but all forward momentum gained while sliding down the wave is lost once the wave peak has overtaken you and you’re climbing back up the wave. Basically, waves will induce a circular motion on a floating object. There’s ways to trick and gain for…

Second order wave effects can cause drifting also.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#69

Post by chriswarbo »

proto-n wrote: post #66
danielbarla wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That makes quite a lot of sense, but it also makes me frown a bit at the phrasing, which I feel is quite misleading. "The digital emissions from this story are an estimated 1.2g to 3.6g CO2 per page view." Re-reading it, technically they are right, if "view" is taken in a non-technical fashion. But everyone reading that text would assume if they click refresh, the emissions are doubled. Also, I do wonder if they take…

Also why not add sustinance cost for the human looking at the device then? Food, water, heating/cooling, clothes, glasses, etc... Proportionally for 2 minutes of course.

Those costs would be the same if the article was read from a newspaper or magazine, so they can be factored out.

Re: A new design ship in the Philippines is partly powered by wave energy

#70

Post by barbegal »

Zeebrommer wrote: post #63
barbegal wrote: post #40

Are there any technical details available for this system? The linked article doesn't do a good job of explaining how it works or how much impact it will have. Assuming the boat can harness 10% of the wave's energy, wave power in the Philippines is more like 10kW per meter of wave length captured on average so that equates to ~1kW per metre of wave. Let's assume this boat can capture roughly 10m of wave then that is…

This is exactly the kind of order-of-magnitude estimation that I was looking for in the article. Where did you get the wave energy numbers?

I got them from this map https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:World_wave_energy_...
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