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Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

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Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#101

Post by ohazi »

jointpdf wrote: post #92
ohazi wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vast majority of people that visit national parks stay at campsites that are attached to parking lots, that have running water and bathroom facilities, and that have at least some cell reception. Many of these are attached to well marked, well traveled trails with amazing views that make for excellent all-day hikes. You don't need a PLB to visit one of these camp sites or hike some of these trails. But if your of…

I have (semi-)frequently gone “off-grid” far away from established trails, without carrying a PLB. Sometimes I’ve gone days without seeing another human. I have extensive training in wilderness navigation, and have always reviewed my itinerary with the rangers ahead of time. In hindsight, I can see how this was a selfish decision. This feeling has been nagging at me for a while, since I’ve had close calls in remote a…

> I believe that a phone is the superior device since you can communicate the severity of your emergency to emergency services and they can respond accordingly.

Agreed -- if you're able to get cell reception, and the emergency is not life-or-death time critical, you should try using the phone first.

> I’d like to read more about this if you have some links:

> > ”now rescue organizations all over the planet are asking you to please...carry a goddamn PLB”

Basically, the search part is really really expensive and time consuming for rescue organizations. You need a lot of man power and a lot of fuel, and the search can go on for days, and you may not even be sure that the person is in the area where you're looking.

If you can eliminate that part, all that's left is a direct flight to the location. It can be done quickly and relatively inexpensively, and is an easy win for both the rescue organization and the parent government (deaths and called-off rescue operations can be politically expensive).

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#102

Post by rapnie »

esperent wrote: post #100
dhsysusbsjsi wrote: post #59

Interestingly the international ground air code for requiring help is normally an X or a V. But I would still write SOS or HELP. You can imagine the scenario: “Hey Jane check out that - looks like a V in the sand” “Heh yeah”. “Weird”. or “Hey Jane does that say HELP?” “Heh yeah. Wanna check it out?” “Yeah let’s take a look”.

How cross culture are HELP or SOS? We're talking about being on a tiny remote island here. There's no guarantee that the people who see your message speak English, or have much exposure to western culture at all. Is SOS known to all cultures?

"No, I can't read what it says. Let's fly ahead." :)

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#103

Post by jessriedel »

jfim wrote: post #28
jessriedel wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few hundred dollars seems fastastically expensive to me. What is possibly inside it that justifies that price?

A few hundred dollars to be able to get help in a potentially life threatening situation sounds fantastically cheap to me. That's the difference between cost plus pricing versus value pricing.

Unless you have some idea how often they are used successfully, you have no whether you're getting a good value.

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#104

Post by jessriedel »

squarefoot wrote: post #80
jessriedel wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few hundred dollars seems fastastically expensive to me. What is possibly inside it that justifies that price?

It's a safety device; it must work reliably in adverse conditions, which is a requirement no consumer device, including €5000 TV sets, can meet. Also I believe in case of failure it would expose the manufacturer to some nasty lawsuits, hence the cost which very likely is equally spread on research, top notch build, quality control and insurance.

Why must it? Why not have they work only with 80% reliability if it could lower the price and put it in the hands of way more people?

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#105

Post by jessriedel »

ohazi wrote: post #52
jessriedel wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few hundred dollars seems fastastically expensive to me. What is possibly inside it that justifies that price?

Seriously, what the fuck is up with this attitude? People will spend thousands of dollars on ultralight gear, and then balk at $300 for a magic button that summons a helicopter when you have a broken leg. It's literally the cheapest life insurance you will ever be able to buy.

You should try making that argument quantitative.

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#107

Post by waheoo »

anyfoo wrote: post #99
waheoo wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universal attention sign is usually three of the same. Three dots in a triangle, three flashs in a row, etc. Its just easy for the human mind to detect it as an unnatural pattern. It still probably better to use SOS or help but sometimes that's not an option.

I can easily see someone making, for example, three giant triangles or circles for a variety of reasons—fun, art, or engineering—without the intent to alarm anyone. If someone were to visibly write out SOS or HELP, though, they are either in need of help, or extraordinarily careless (or even malicious) in their deceit. But that’s unlikely enough to still warrant checking in.

Morse code for SOS was literally based on on this idea of threes.

...---...

I for one, would investigate three triangles in the sand in a remote area. It might be a fun art project for that back country woodsman, but it's much, much, more likely a distress signal, whatever form it takes.

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#108

Post by flingo »

raxxorrax wrote: post #65
ohazi wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "search" part of search and rescue is a solved problem. There's no reason to go into the wilderness without a PLB in 2020. PLBs cost around $300 [1], they have five+ year batteries, and they don't require a subscription. If you need to use it, you turn it on, it grabs a GPS lock and transmits your coordinates for about a day, during which at least one satellite will see your signal and downlinks all over the plan…

Somehow I prefer this solution than ubiquitous drones with superior audiovisual capabilities everywhere and especially in the most remote regions of the planet.

> Somehow I prefer this solution than ubiquitous drones

"When all you have is a hammer..." My only question is where most of that $300 cost is coming from.

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#109

Post by esperent »

rapnie wrote: post #102
esperent wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How cross culture are HELP or SOS? We're talking about being on a tiny remote island here. There's no guarantee that the people who see your message speak English, or have much exposure to western culture at all. Is SOS known to all cultures?

"No, I can't read what it says. Let's fly ahead." :)

Well, yeah. But then any message would work. The person I was responding to said you should write SOS or HELP instead of the international air codes for help (X or V), which any pilot is almost certain to know.

Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand

#110

Post by checkyoursudo »

staplung wrote: post #79

Reminds me of the Farside comic: https://imgur.com/r/TheFarSide/hQAT2Go

I feel like I remember a Gilligan's Island episode where they try to write SOS on the beach and it ends up messed up somehow and ignored, though I can't find anything with a quick search and it's possible that my memory from childhood is faulty.
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