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The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

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Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#261

Post by naikrovek »

john_miller wrote: post #135
skohan wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have compelling evidence of corporations choosing long-term "good will" over short term profits I would be very interested to see it

every generous return policy by a shop every PR action free(as in beer) software (e.g. visual studio) charitable donations (e.g. google to wikipedia) not pressing charges for rampant cracking (photoshop used by students/children) diversity photo ops/hiring practices non-firing of incompetent employees free workshops or tours for the public/children

Those are almost all tax deductions or are required by law.

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#262

Post by naikrovek »

shaan7 wrote: post #55
nudpiedo wrote: post #40

I do not understand people with allergy to non OSS. Compare that to any google service which barely releases the clients as open source, and the clients usually are so complex that may need quite long time to get any professional developer productive in such complex code bases. Also being tied to a controlled protocol, set of libraries, cloud infrastructure which does actually keep your data is in fact the actual evi…

> I do not understand people with allergy to non OSS. Maybe this will help: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24047877 `I don't think it says "Software not open-source is bad". But more something like "It is marketed as open source but it is not".' > just for the sake of keeping OSS folks happy. Heh. Maybe it is just me but that sounds very condescending.

Vscode is open source. You can clone it and build it. The binary you get from Microsoft is that open source stuff plus a small number of closed additions.

Vscodium is some wrapper scripts to download vscode source, fix up a dev environment suitable for building vscode, and building it while rebranding it "vscodium".

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#263

Post by naikrovek »

ShamelessC wrote: post #235
Deukhoofd wrote: post #8

The best parts of Code are the editor functions. If I had to name the good parts of Code I wouldn't even think about LiveShare, it's mostly a gimmick I've looked at once or twice. As for the marketplace, most extensions link to their github repositories, from where you can download and install the extensions. The marketplace itself is mostly a convenience thing.

I had never even heard of LiveShare until today.

LiveShare is pretty great.

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#264

Post by naikrovek »

worble wrote: post #95

>Such as the VS Codium project which provides VS Code binaries without the proprietary parts. But also, as a consequence of this, without the Marketplace of extensions. It's worth noting you can easily switch vscodium back to using the official extension marketplace by changing the product.json file as noted here: https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#ext... They note the legality of this is dubiou…

Vscodium isn't different from vscode. It IS vscode. Vscodium is merely some scripts to download the vscode source, and compile it while removing Microsoft branding.

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#265

Post by patatapatato »

fadzlan wrote: post #130

The extension by design is made to be optional to use and are not integral (I would argue) to the vanilla experience of VS Code. That also means that if other people wants to create their own proprietary extensions they can do so. The basic experience of the plain VS Code does not change. Now one can say indeed that the Remote and also LiveShare is the best extension there of, and since the extension author decides n…

VSCode is not open source, VSCodium is.

VSCode includes extra twitter/microsoft spyware (or "telemetry" for those who prefer that euphemism).

The "VSCode" binary you download includes unknown proprietary extras.

Fun fact : VSCode official home page used to have the motto "Open Source", now it is "Built on Open Source" (check on the wayback machine if you don't believe me)

I guess the MS legal team was afraid of keeping lying about the openness of VScode yet they knew Open Source is a good buzzword to attract devs so they played with words.

This is the typical big corporate approach :

Step 1) Say you develop an Open Platform so that you get many users and free contributions.

Step 2) Once you own the market and people are too addicted to switch, bit by bit make it proprietary, add more spyware.

This is the story of Android , VSCode, ONNXRuntime, and many others.

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#266

Post by edoceo »

codemonkey-zeta wrote: post #255
edoceo wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The person I was replying to used the words "critical" and "core". As to best (admittedly subjective) if they are so good I'd think that one of the 100s of devs I know depend on them. The only close one was Remote - which other editors do too - When I showed that remote drops code to the far end machine we determined that to be too risky - and went back to sshfs. Also, if those extension are so "best" why hasn't a re…

I don't agree with the word choice of the parent, but I think the argument stands if you replace "critical" and "core" with "best". That's why I chose to re-reference the original article. I'm curious if you've used the live share features personally, and if you have if you've found value in them. I suspect many devs do not like collaborative programming in general, and so may never use them or like them if they have…

I love pair programming. I teach loads of juniors, that's how I know so many devs (that and hiring/recruiting).

So, the features of LiveShare I found are better handled with external tools. But that is mostly because I don't want anyone to become to dependent on one tool. How can I LiveShare between emacs and Sublime? WebRTC screenshare+A/V works a treat, across editors and systems.

I don't find VSCode, or it's extension super compelling. But it is very nice.

I think the feature I like the best, built in, is that debugger - that's easier/smoother than Atom, or jEdit or any others that I've used in the last 20 years. It's like what was available in Visual Studio 6 (c1999).

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#267

Post by smaudet »

fadzlan wrote: post #130

The extension by design is made to be optional to use and are not integral (I would argue) to the vanilla experience of VS Code. That also means that if other people wants to create their own proprietary extensions they can do so. The basic experience of the plain VS Code does not change. Now one can say indeed that the Remote and also LiveShare is the best extension there of, and since the extension author decides n…

Perhaps it is worthwhile to mint some new phrasing.

VS Code is a closed, proprietary platform. Something like emacs, vim is 100% open source, open platform.

Open platforms tend to be a lot easier to write code for, use, extend, etc. You can't build an editing empire on VS Code - at the end of the day no matter how brilliant you are, they own the distribution 100%, so it might as well be closed source - much the same as how there are hundreds of open source clients for twitter, 'open access' APIs, but Twitter is very much, very, very proprietary.

The promise of OSS is and was that you can always freely modify, build, hack on whatever, and that you don't have to be a talented reverse engineer to do it or write large swathes of 'special sauce' magic drivers yourself. Its almost the same gambit as Apple's - Darwin is indeed Open Source but nobody would say OSX is open source - quite the opposite.

Locked down proprietary walled-garden cant-take-your-code-wherever premium platform with a very much pay-to-play mindset. Which, I'm not surprised - its great that MS is doing open source, cool beans, but who really thought they'd become a charity or a truly concerned 'digital citizen'. Although those types of (succesful) companies are becoming rarer and rarer, as is wont to do with capitalism.

Don't blame the license, blame the motivations?

Re: The best Parts of Visual Studio Code are proprietary

#268

Post by belltaco »

patatapatato wrote: post #265
fadzlan wrote: post #130

The extension by design is made to be optional to use and are not integral (I would argue) to the vanilla experience of VS Code. That also means that if other people wants to create their own proprietary extensions they can do so. The basic experience of the plain VS Code does not change. Now one can say indeed that the Remote and also LiveShare is the best extension there of, and since the extension author decides n…

VSCode is not open source, VSCodium is. VSCode includes extra twitter/microsoft spyware (or "telemetry" for those who prefer that euphemism). The "VSCode" binary you download includes unknown proprietary extras. Fun fact : VSCode official home page used to have the motto "Open Source", now it is " Built on Open Source" (check on the wayback machine if you don't believe me) I guess the MS legal team was afraid of keep…

Telemetry isn't a euphemism for spyware.
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