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We quit our jobs to build a cabin

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Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#331

Post by hbosch »

0xffff2 wrote: post #174
Johnny555 wrote: post #88

When we had nothing but the floor, we were still sketching and debating ridiculous design ideas over our morning coffee—curved, pagoda-style rooflines; walls that folded down into decks; a spiral staircase wrapping around a tree trunk to the loft—as if we were made of money and time. I wonder if they told the buyer that the cabin was built by 2 underfunded inexperienced guys with no plans? They aren't out of the wood…

Yeah, seriously. I'm a bit shocked that it's even legal for them to sell this cabin. Surely permits should have been required somewhere along the way?

I think the permitting process is a bit different for places like this. Depends on what kind of power you're using: solar or utility? You have a sewer, or a well, or do you collect your own water and compost waste? People build and modify structures all the time with and without permits. If the bureaucrats had their way you'd need a permit to change a lightbulb.

Also, is it a residence? This could easily be considered a "storage shed" as much as it could be considered a "house", much like RVs are insured differently than jobsite pickup trucks.

Furthermore, it's more or less on the buyer to make the call about a structure's safety and value. Even buying a regular house, in a regular neighborhood, you can go ahead and buy it even if the inspector says it's going to burn down within a year. The bank might not loan you the money, but you can buy it as long as you can afford it. Houses get bought and sold every day that don't meet electrical, plumbing or general safety codes.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#332

Post by donovanr »

This rings _so_ true.

While I was in grad school I got bored sitting behind a computer all day, and my wife and I decided to build a tiny house on a trailer as a way of venting our pent-up DIY urges. We'd just build it in our spare time. LOL.

We started in the late summer of 2013, with a trailer and no plans and a stack of construction books from the library.

Cut to spring 2016, having spent every single weekend and most evenings since (in zero degree winters and brutal Pittsburgh summers) sweating and swearing, really pushing the "divorce cabin" line, and having legitimate discussions late at night about the benefits of burning it all to the ground, where my wife, eight month pregnant, is trying to finish the trim work before I submit my dissertation and we tow it across the country.

The way the article captures the "not knowing what we were getting into" / tiny things that delay you to death / stressed out / losing friends / doing absolutely nothing else with your life / so over budget it hurts / final elation at success is absolutely perfect.

We only made it across the finish line because living in Pittsburgh on a grad student stipend is actually, well, livable, and I could do that while my wife worked pretty much full time on our housing boondoggle.

The main learning experience coming out of it was that you should absolutely pay how ever many thousands of dollars it costs for a good set of plans from someone who's done this before. Learning smaller tasks like framing and roofing etc is easy. Stitching it all together into a plan that you're arguing about because neither of you have any idea what you're doing, all while you're wasting precious daylight is _hard_. We would have finished at least a year sooner if we just had plans to follow.

All that said, building a place to live in was super rewarding (as others have said) type II fun.

We still have it, it's beautiful, and I have not yet burned it down.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#333

Post by sushshshsh »

ChrisLomont wrote: post #325
sushshshsh wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a softeare dev who used to work in the contracting space, I cannot tell you how many stories I have of licensed, insured, regulated tradesmen going to jobsites and the outcome being burned down houses, flooded houses, oil spills, trees falling onto houses, and just monetary and physical damages galore. If you have the time and desire to do things carefully, truly, then you will do things carefully. You'll find tha…

>I cannot tell you how many stories This is not the metric. It's a self selected post hoc measurement, subject to mental bias. The proper way is to measure all pros that do a task, then the ratio that did badly, then do the same thing for amateurs, and do so carefully (preferably somehow double blind) to remove cognitive bias. Then compare ratios. When such things are done, I find almost every time notice my (and lik…

Then don't construct in a wetland? 90% of building involves avoiding risk, not developing Herculean skills to overcome risks.

It would be like if I lived in Thailand and then complained that I got electrocuted trying to set up a really complicated AC system. If you aren't willing to put in the time to do that kind of electrical work safely, then ask yourself why you really want to live in an area where that type of work is a pressing requirement.

I don't subscribe to your philosophy that all contractors are superheroes that are immune to messing things up. I'm not paying $125 an hour for a guy who lives in a tin shack to come and tell me how much of a pro he is just to disappear the moment I discover some deficiency in his work.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#334

Post by throwaway0a5e »

throw51319 wrote: post #291
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can easily get cheap empty land in the American West so long as it's farther from the nearest city than your average Javascript crapping baboon is willing to drive with his family in the car for a weekend getaway and the parcel is too small for any commercial use. The east coast is similar but all the numbers are smaller and the baboons shit under-performing pharmaceuticals and financial products instead of Javas…

Rofl. Yeah it actually makes complete sense. If you're willing to dig in and make stuff happen, so that your skills/chutzpah combo is like 2-3 standard devs outside the norm... you can get a crazy good deal.

>so that your skills/chutzpah combo is like 2-3 standard devs outside the norm... you can get a crazy good deal.

This is true in so many different applications.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#335

Post by redisman »

look_lookatme wrote: post #92
mdavidn wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YouTube's recommendations may be more a reflection of your watch history than a shift in content or a change in the algorithm. I have not seen any van life, off-grid, or tiny home videos on YouTube.

This is probably true.

Just open an incognito and count the van-life videos. Zero. It's all popular lowest-common denominator videos until you start clicking and teaching Youtube about your preferences.

My work and home gmail accounts get completely different videos because of how I use them. At work it's all background music and albums and at home it's more fun stuff.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#336

Post by bfostbfostbfost »

treis wrote: post #165
bfostbfostbfost wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For renovations I try to do as much work as possible, eg tile removal/replacement, backer board removal/replacement....let the plumber come in to a clean and prepped worksite for a valve sweat....he’s in and out ASAP, I’ve saved budget from just throwing money at a GP contractor to do everything, and I get to do the non-expert stuff myself. But I think that the schmo vs pro divide is real when you get to electrical,…

>But I think that the schmo vs pro divide is real when you get to electrical, plumbing etc. HE’S the pro, and I’m the Schmo. IMHO, this is backwards. Electrical work is twisting wires and screwing them down. Plumbing is gluing or clamping stuff together (unless you're sweating copper). The actual mechanics of doing it takes little skill and pros aren't going to be that much better/faster than you. The real difference…

I agree with you, but for me it’s a risk and liability thing. It’s also a function of what I have had the experience doing...I can actually hang/tape/mud drywall semi decently, DEFINITELY not as fast or as good as a pro. Same with tiling, flooring etc , most cosmetic things. But I’ve never had the opportunity to learn much about plumbing or electrical. And those could have huge consequences if not done properly.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#337

Post by Johnny555 »

hbosch wrote: post #331
0xffff2 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, seriously. I'm a bit shocked that it's even legal for them to sell this cabin. Surely permits should have been required somewhere along the way?

I think the permitting process is a bit different for places like this. Depends on what kind of power you're using: solar or utility? You have a sewer, or a well, or do you collect your own water and compost waste? People build and modify structures all the time with and without permits. If the bureaucrats had their way you'd need a permit to change a lightbulb. Also, is it a residence? This could easily be considere…

As long as it's all disclosed, then it's probably fine. It's not only on the buyer to figure it out -- the buyer doesn't need to tear off the drywall to see if the house was taped together with duct tape instead of using nails. (but he might end up doing that if he has reason to doubt the construction quality). If the seller built the house himself without any professional guidance or inspection, he needs to disclose it.

I don't know about unincorporated areas, but around here if you put power and water in a shed, it's no longer just a shed and you need permits. And I think that if it's meant for human habitation even without power or water, you need the permits (though you may not get the permit without lighting and water/sewer)

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#338

Post by 0xffff2 »

hbosch wrote: post #331
0xffff2 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, seriously. I'm a bit shocked that it's even legal for them to sell this cabin. Surely permits should have been required somewhere along the way?

I think the permitting process is a bit different for places like this. Depends on what kind of power you're using: solar or utility? You have a sewer, or a well, or do you collect your own water and compost waste? People build and modify structures all the time with and without permits. If the bureaucrats had their way you'd need a permit to change a lightbulb. Also, is it a residence? This could easily be considere…

I don't know about Washington, but in Oregon if it has electrical you need permits. Full stop.

It's absolutely not on the buyer. It's on the buyer to do their due diligence, but it is certainly unethical, if not illegal to sell this cabin without disclosing that all of the work (especially but not limited to plumbing and electrical) was done by untrained and unlicensed amateurs. It's probably illegal too, but I don't have the expertise to be sure of that. And while my libertarian leanings make me comfortable using disclosures at time of sale to put some of the liability on the buyer, I'm very much not sure that the law sees it that way.

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#339

Post by logicslave12 »

jaeming wrote: post #172

I used to have dreams like this. I attempted to chase these ideas every few years. I quit a very good job once and moved halfway around the world in an attempt to fulfill one of these dreams. At some point I got married and eventually had kids after which these kinds of romanticized ad-hoc adventures became impractical. Sometimes I wish I'd been more focused when I was young. I feel like I probably wasted a lot of ti…

So your dreams didn’t pan out, but for others it has. There’s always value in shooting for more in life. You only live once

Re: We quit our jobs to build a cabin

#340

Post by cercatrova »

TimSchumann wrote: post #18
kyleblarson wrote: post #11

I purchased land in the North Cascades area (Methow Valley, about 3 hours Northeast of Index where these guys built) in 2007 with the intention of building a weekend home myself. I prepped the property myself and ran the main power. It was a junk show and I quickly learned that the best approach was to continue writing software and pay pros to do the job. That was one of the best decisions I have ever made. My wife a…

> It was a junk show and I quickly learned that the best approach was to continue writing software and pay pros to do the job. I feel personally attacked. Really though, I wonder how many things are on my 'Someday Maybe' list, that really I should just make more money to accomplish and/or find a youtube subscription that satisfies the urge to tinker on a particular topic.

Do people really watch YouTube or something and feel like the accomplished whatever is shown in the video? I am asking with full earnestness as I've always viewed such r/ArtisanVideos type videos as pure entertainment.
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