Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you • Hacker News Board

Re: Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you

#161

Post by chordalkeyboard » Mon, Aug 03, 2020, 1:32 AM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #151

chordalkeyboard wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The payout is the risk you transferred to the insurance company. You’re not “supposed” to get all your premiums back because then why would anyone start an insurance company? Its not a bank account, its more like a lottery ticket. The insurer assumes risk of covering an accident in exchange for the guaranteed income of your monthly premiums. In return you exchange a fixed regular payment for protection against an unl…

I'm not asking for my premiums back and don't expect it. Just saying that after 5 years of premiums the insurance company would be break even on that policy. If premiums are high enough its not really insurance. Not that everyone has the same insurance company but generally if everyone has paid premiums that meet the value of the car after 5 years then all of the insurance company risk is with cars less than 5 years…

well how much capital are you investing for 5 years at zero percent return? I think if that was required for an insurance company there would be no insurance companies.

> Making apps and integrating with telematics doesn't come for free and its not coming out of the insurance company bottom line.

yes, it is. their bottom line has to make room for that by increasing prices. in insurance as in anything, you get what you pay for.

Re: Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you

#162

Post by chordalkeyboard » Mon, Aug 03, 2020, 1:35 AM UTC

Shared404 wrote: post #148

chordalkeyboard wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything you have said except for the last phrase “ sometimes companies are so big they influence the laws themselves“ is false. There are a fantastic amount of regulations in every western country today, many of which are applied arbitrarily or with enough discretion that they are essentially arbitrary. Even the most massive corporations market caps are dwarfed by the monthly spending of government. The only cases…

Just enough regulations to get the worst of unregulated and regulated capitalism, at least if my understanding is correct.

yes, and whether this reflects poorly on capitalism, democracy, regulations, the corporate structure in a given country, the people in a given corporation, or the system as a whole depends to a large extent on your priors.

Re: Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you

#163

Post by justanotherc » Fri, Aug 07, 2020, 9:44 AM UTC

sroussey wrote: post #31

justanotherc wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The justice system has built into it the requirement to justify allegations against you though. By design everything in the justice system is transparent or its not admissible. So an opaque "score" of any sort wouldn't ever be acceptable evidence.

You are thinking in about evidence in court. Police have other data that can flag you for greater scrutiny. Then your chances of even being in court go up.

But they have to establish reasonable suspicion, wuch they also have to justify in court in order to investigate you further.

They can't just say "he had a bad score, so I pulled him over and found weed". If they did that, the stop would be unjustified and the whole case would be thrown out.

Re: Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you

#164

Post by justanotherc » Fri, Aug 07, 2020, 9:47 AM UTC

inetknght wrote: post #106

justanotherc wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The justice system has built into it the requirement to justify allegations against you though. By design everything in the justice system is transparent or its not admissible. So an opaque "score" of any sort wouldn't ever be acceptable evidence.

> By design everything in the justice system is transparent or its not admissible. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction

Evidence constructed in parallel is not admissible, therefore my point stands. So what's your point?

Re: Data isn't just being collected from your phone, it's being used to score you

#165

Post by sidewndr46 » Fri, Aug 07, 2020, 5:27 PM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #157

sidewndr46 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually more along the lines of whatever a person's life is worth. Also where I live the ~3 cars around me in traffic could each cost more than a nearby home. You can pretty easily destroy $400,000 of property here in an otherwise uneventful accident.

Automobile deaths has been declining for years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in... Cars are safer than ever. https://one.nhtsa.gov/nhtsa/timeline/index.html The folks with those fancy cars are paying into the system too, insurance is about pooling after all. It seems you have a point about bodily injury claims. https://www.insurance-research.org/sites/default/files/downl... However, it lo…

I don't really understand the point your are trying to make? You state that "insurance is about pooling" then correctly observe the dollar amount they charge you is just some sort of risk rating assigned to the individual.

Also if you ever have a large claim paid, you'll quickly discover it isn't about pooling at all. Every insurer will simple decline to quote you or simply quote you some insane price. Even without accidents I once got a quote that was obviously a response of "please do not purchase this policy" when I tried to get basic liability insurance.