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TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

reuters.com

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Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#371

Post by manquer »

vkou wrote: post #337
katzgrau wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The President shouldn't have authority to ban anything at all let alone an app available through privately operated app stores. If it's a matter of national security, yes, he should. Whether it's ultimately seen as an abuse of power can be decided later in courts or via election.

TikTok is not a national security problem, no more than Whatsapp or Telegram or Skype is a national security problem. The last time I asked folks here to explain to me why they think its a national security problem, I got a list of arguments that were just a little bit less plausible then those for the existence of Santa Claus. Just because Trump says something (while providing no proof) does not make it true.

Grindr was a national security problem . The precedent is there.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#372

Post by MangoCoffee »

volgo wrote: post #140

The interesting thing is that these platforms come and go. One year it’s Vine, another year it’s Snap, now it’s TikTok. ByteDance bought musically for $1B in 2017 and turned it into Tok. 3 years later, it’s grown like crazy because it’s the latest fad and would be smart for them to cash out before the next new thing hits The whole divestment thing is probably a godsend for ByteDance, “forcing” them to liquidate their…

>it’s the latest fad and would be smart for them to cash out before the next new thing hits

i used to think FB is just a fad but its been 16 years and it is still going. Not as fancy as it once was but enough to make billions.

who to say TikTok won't last? if it last more than 10 years. its already earn back all its cost and some more.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#373

Post by flywheel »

billfruit wrote: post #195

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

[flagged]

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#374

Post by MangoCoffee »

Some people here think TikTok is a fad. I used to think FB is a fad but 16 years later. FB is still here. Not as shiny as it used to be but enough to make billions.

I don't know if TikTok is a fad and you don't either. If TikTok last more than 10 years. It already make back its cost and some more.

Heck, Snap is still around and it used to be a meme stock on WallStreetBets.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#375

Post by chrischen »

crusty wrote: post #331
DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China locks American companies out of its market This is something that is often claimed, but it doesn't reflect reality. China does not generally lock American companies out of its market. In fact, American companies have a far greater presence in the Chinese market than vice versa. For example, take a look at the 2017 China sales figures for a few American companies: [1] * Apple: $44.7 billion * Intel: $14.8 bill…

This is apples and oranges. You listed hard good sales - imports (even if actually manufactured in China in the case of Apple). IIRC, Foreign companies need to have majority-owner Chinese partner entities to "own" business operations in China. So a non-Chinese car company that wants to have ownership over it's Chinese assembly line operations and sales in China needs to partner with a Chinese company (typically anoth…

> This is apples and oranges. You listed hard good sales - imports (even if actually manufactured in China in the case of Apple).

How much do you think China makes on an iPhone? Most of the pricey parts are imported into China and just because the assembly happens in China doesn’t truth make it “made” in China.

Even if you take lower margin brands like KFC, the US interests essentially rent-seek on that brand usage.

You have to also understand that China is the economic underdog. In order to rise out of poverty they have to have some form of protectionist policies (which are not unique to China, as Japan also has heavy protectionist policies despite an already strong economy) or they’d be trampled by established foreign multinational giants.

One country is a well to-do suburban college educated kid and the other is a poor high school dropout from the inner city. Their competition in the market would not be “fair” as their starting points would be unequal.

That being said protectionist policies aren’t all good. They are a tradeoff that they chose to make and why they ended up with defective domestically produced infant baby formula, crappier internet search engines (which lead to wechat dominance), etc, whole local companies played slow catch up.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#376

Post by whoevercares »

pm90 wrote: post #330
toomuchtodo wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How else would you negotiate with a bully like China? America is a bully too, but without Uighur concentration camps, fleets of fishing vessels farming the sea to extinction, outrageous claims over the South China Sea, etc. You can only turn a blind eye so long to a competitor’s unreasonable actions (in this scope, IP/trade secrets and the like). As a US citizen, I endorse any actions intended to remove or subdue CCP…

If you’re going to list vices, you better list those of both sides. America is the largest emitter of greenhouse gases by far and is this directly responsible for the climate change catastrophes we are watching unfold before our eyes. EDIT: this fact is incorrect, please see child comment for the facts. It looks like China currently emits twice the amount of Greenhouse gases emitted by the US. (Not justifying what Ch…

Does comparing the total always make sense? How about we take the average? Twice the amount means each Chinese person emit about 1/5 greenhouse of an American does. Man are created equal and Chinese people have the equal right to emit for their own prosperity

Reminds me of some downplay of China’s progress by looking at averages

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#377

Post by toomuchtodo »

whoevercares wrote: post #376
pm90 wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re going to list vices, you better list those of both sides. America is the largest emitter of greenhouse gases by far and is this directly responsible for the climate change catastrophes we are watching unfold before our eyes. EDIT: this fact is incorrect, please see child comment for the facts. It looks like China currently emits twice the amount of Greenhouse gases emitted by the US. (Not justifying what Ch…

Does comparing the total always make sense? How about we take the average? Twice the amount means each Chinese person emit about 1/5 greenhouse of an American does. Man are created equal and Chinese people have the equal right to emit for their own prosperity Reminds me of some downplay of China’s progress by looking at averages

Prosperity is not a right. Past emissions by some do not create future emissions allowances for others. We should all be held accountable for future emissions, as the climate cares little for equality concerns.

With that said, it’s entirely feasible to transition faster to not needing to emit carbon to raise or maintain quality of life. As I mention above, everyone should be accountable for that.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#378

Post by em500 »

m0zg wrote: post #358
billfruit wrote: post #195

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

I'm old enough to remember how in 2017 people were un-ironically talking about putting Zuck in jail because Russia allegedly ("allegedly" because it was never proven this was state sponsored) spent $100K to organize some pro- and anti-Trump protests on Facebook, and Facebook allowed Cambridge Analytica do essentially the same data harvesting as Obama's campaign in 2012. But a Chinese communist party controlled media…

I think what OP is arguing is fairly straightforward: if TikTok violated actual laws, take them to court, if they didn't, leave them alone. Is the USA supposed to be country that respects the rule of law, or a banana republic directed by the whims of some supreme leader?

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#379

Post by chrischen »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #293
andrewPP wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook and Google quit China because they didn't want to obey the speech control policy which not as democratic as in the U.S. They could have continued to operate in China had they chosen to follow the rules set up by Chinese regulators. With the TikTok it is a different story. They are willing to obey all laws of US and the Trump admistration still wants to ban it without sound reason. This is ridiculous from my…

How facile to compare the situations of companies "when they follow [China's] rules" and "when they obey US laws" as if they are equivalent. America is being arbitrary, capricious, and unfair, in contradiction to the neutral and generally applicable law in America. But China's legal system has been arbitrary and capricious for decades, and is rotten to the core, consistently elevating the whims of the ruling party ov…

Yea let’s admit it, China’s right. We should all go to a planned economy like them because we no longer believe a free market will work (sarcasm).

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#380

Post by YarickR2 »

billfruit wrote: post #195

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

From world policeman to world bully, in 4 short years
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