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The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

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Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#341

Post by scarface74 »

627467 wrote: post #313
moralsupply wrote: post #7

The article states that Apple is extorting users. Is Apple forcing anybody to use their services?

If by anybody you include their own customers... Yes. The case here is driven mostly by Spotify who claim (my paraphrasing) they cannot benefit Apple customers equaly because of Apple restrictive practices and fee model. You may not have purchased a Apple device with intention to use with Spotify, but others may. (Now extrapolate the Spotify story to any appmaker who wish to sell to Apple customers)

Spotify in fact doesn’t go through the App Store for purchases.

The better question is why hasn’t Spotify made a decent watch app that can stream directly to it and download music for off line use? Apple added the ability last year.

How much of a cut does Spotify take from musicians to be on its platform?

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#342

Post by corylulu »

cyrksoft wrote: post #290
Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not like someone will force you paying without your consent. If you don't want to give random apps your credit card, don't give it to them. Why do you oppose other people's right to do that, if they need it?

The same could be said the other way around. Why force a private company to open its system? Apple built the entire ecosystem and you want to force them to open it up to your desire. Why is that ok?

For the same reason antitrust laws exist. Monopolies need to be prevented to maintain a healthy economy.

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#343

Post by scarface74 »

627467 wrote: post #317
coldtea wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody forces anybody to buy an Apple product... In fact, Apple charges more, so it makes it even more difficult to buy them than an Android phone -- which also has multiple app install options. Why not use that?

Once you buy an apple product you lose freedoms others have. So, while no one forces me to buy from apple, once I buy apple I'm forced to buy only what apple sees fit.

And once I buy a Tesla I can’t buy gas like most others can. Whose fault is it that you made a choice that doesn’t fit your needs?

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#344

Post by diego_moita »

scarface74 wrote: post #323
Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually do just that: I don't buy apple's devices, for precisely this reason. And I happen to actually like them. This argument you make is actually done to the death. If you don't like Jenko's oil (ever read "The Godfather"?), you may just not buy it. It is a monopoly, and it hurts consumers. I'm actually very surprised that this freedom-loving public here on HN is so happy be restricted by their shiny digital ha…

What do the first two syllables in “monopoly” mean?

Mono means "one", poly means many, as in: one supplier (Apple) for many customers (iPhone users).

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#345

Post by scarface74 »

inopinatus wrote: post #156
moralsupply wrote: post #7

The article states that Apple is extorting users. Is Apple forcing anybody to use their services?

Yes. Apple's rules oblige app vendors to not advertise or link to any external method of signing up for a service. So, not only can you can only use Apple's payment methods, but you have to lie (by omission) to consumers about their options. This is the market distortion of the App Store.

Can I put a product in Walmart and tell users they can get it cheaper elsewhere - in Walmart?

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#346

Post by scarface74 »

diego_moita wrote: post #344
scarface74 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do the first two syllables in “monopoly” mean?

Mono means "one", poly means many, as in: one supplier (Apple) for many customers (iPhone users).

So now we define monopoly as only one company can sell its own products? Doesn’t that make every company a monopoly?

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#347

Post by grishka »

jlnthws wrote: post #296

Apple sells an experience, it's hard to find a common ground to those single store monopoly issues without compromising this experience and tarnishing Apple's precious image. Suppose Apple standardizes jailbreaking: say they allow you to turn on a switch that creates a sandbox on your device for you to do whatever you want. Your device would then be running freestyle without warranty, fair enough for me as a first mo…

Macs have had the ability to run unsigned code with no hindrance for ages. There even were numerous software products that modified the system itself. None of this was "tarnishing Apple's precious image". Moreover, back before Apple started notoriously enforcing app signatures requiring a $99 annual fee, people used to love Macs more. They enjoyed the experience of being able to run whatever the hell they wanted on a device they own.

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#348

Post by scarface74 »

bhupy wrote: post #309
scarface74 wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know what the “mono” in “monopoly” means right?

No, I'm an idiot, please explain it to me. Of course I know what it means — the argument is way more nuanced than "hurr durr there are 2 and 2 > 1".

It actually isn’t. When you have a choice between paying a premium and paying half as much like 85% of the world. It isn’t a monopoly.

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#349

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

cyrksoft wrote: post #290
Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not like someone will force you paying without your consent. If you don't want to give random apps your credit card, don't give it to them. Why do you oppose other people's right to do that, if they need it?

The same could be said the other way around. Why force a private company to open its system? Apple built the entire ecosystem and you want to force them to open it up to your desire. Why is that ok?

Because it is acting against the interests of the users.

Would you still support Apple's position if, say, Apple would roll out update to iOS with new EULA, which would require you to give up your firstborn son for a Satan sacrifice?

Of course, you can refuse, but the device that you supposedly "own" would effectively stop functioning (obsoleted iOS devices lose their usefulness very fast: try doing anything with iPhone 5).

Re: The App Store is a monopoly: Here's why the EU is correct to investigate Apple

#350

Post by dcbadacd »

scarface74 wrote: post #326
echelon wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you support Apple and Google in their claims to 30% of the profit, then you support Comcast charging an additional fee for Netflix. If you support Apple and Google having locked down authoritative control over the code run on their devices, then you support the Great Firewall. The only choice of a free and open society, and one mindful of the great benefit of open source and open platforms, is to remove these comp…

If you support Apple and Google in their claims to 30% of the profit, then you support Comcast charging an additional fee for Netflix. And guess what? I don’t have to use Comcast.

> And guess what? I don’t have to use Comcast.

Pretending everyone has that choice not to.

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